Andrew Anthony Guerrero
Don’t you love those stories where the high school sweethearts get married, have children, build a home and a family, just like they do in the movies? They face their share of hard times, but somehow, some way, our young lovers manage to work through every difficulty that’s put in their path, and they live happily ever after. Yeah, sometimes it’s really cool to hear about a couple like that.
This, however, is not one of those stories.
When Nicolette Lyons-Reed met Andrew Anthony Guerrero at high school in Kansas City, Kansas, people thought it was a match made in heaven. But from what I could gather about their marriage, Andrew soon became verbally, emotionally and physically abusive, especially after their son Seth was born. What is clear is that he had a volcanic temper, and Nicolette was terrified of him.
Lyons-Reed’s parents said she lived in fear of Guerrero. She was so afraid of him, they said, that she began divorce proceedings against him while he was overseas serving in the military in Afghanistan.
Eva Lyons, Nicolette’s mother, had this to say about her daughter’s relationship with Andrew Guerrero:
“I know a lot of people think the way it happened, her filing while he was gone was wrong, but they don’t know the details. It was out of fear. They don’t know what he could have done.”
Her father, Robert Lyons, added:
“She was quite worried about what could happen. She wanted Andrew to get help, because he had an anger problem.”
I’ll admit even I thought that filing on Andrew while he was deployed with his National Guard unit as a helicopter mechanic was a little underhanded. That is, until I discovered how 
the courts handled him after he got back.
A neighbor said that Nicolette was afraid of her ex-husband and that Andrew often left her flowers and a note, hoping to reconcile. She told the neighbor that Andrew wasn’t suppose to contact her, telling the neighbor to call police if he ever came back.
Court records confirm that a year after the couple divorced, she was granted a restraining order. Her attorney said she had received threatening emails from Andrew and that he was only allowed visitation with their son Seth if he was attending therapy.
Sounds to me like Andrew was more than just a little on the unstable side, and we all know that what Nicolette saw as concern for Seth’s wellbeing was see as her keeping his son away from him in Andrew’s eye’s. Men who act out the way Guerrero did usually have a hard time accepting the consequences of their actions, and lash out at the person they perceive as the threat to their little world. 
And lash out he would.
After the divorce, Nicolette tried to move on with her life. She married a sailor named Joe Reed, and they had a daughter they called Leah. Even though Andrew was still there causing problems, Nicolette and Joe were happy when they were together. They began to build a life for themselves, Seth, and Leah.
Andrew Guerrero was having none of that. On February 2nd, 2008 he changed the headline of his MySpace page to “this is the day that I die. farewell.” and “Snake is going to take it all back!”
He drove to Nicolette Lyons-Reed’s house – He had waited for a day when Joe Reed was out of town on maneuvers – and forced his way inside. He pulled out a 9MM semi automatic pistol and immediately shot 8 month old Leah Lyons-Reed point blank. Nicolette grabbed Seth, ran for the bathroom and locked the door, but it was no use. Guerrero kicked the door in and shot Nicolette Lyons-Reed to death. Police say both mother and child were shot execution style. Only after an autopsy would they discover that Nicolette was also pregnant with her third child.
Guerrero then grabbed his son Seth and took off for the border in 2004 Nissan pickup truck. Kansas Law Enforcement quickly issued an Amber Alert for the 3-year-old, and it wasn’t very long before he and his father were traced to a Motel in Denton, Texas. Not that they had to try all that hard, since Andrew “the master criminal” Guerrero signed in under his real name. He was taken into custody by a SWAT team without incident and Seth was returned to Kansas, where his maternal grandparents were given custody.
Guerrero was indicted on two counts of Capital Murder for the deaths of Nicolette and Leah Lyons-Reed, and on count of Felony Murder for the death of Nicolette’s unborn fetus, Under a new Kansas law, called Alexa’s Law. In keeping with his pattern of dodging responsibility for his actions, he plead guilty to all charges in order to avoid the death penalty he almost certainly would have received.
At Guerrero’s sentencing, you’d think he’d have something to say. You know, show some small sign of remorse, at least for the innocent 8-month old baby he executed like a dog. Not a chance. He had absolutely nothing to say, and showed no reaction as he listened to the victim’s impact statements. His lawyer tried to salvage what he could, saying Andrew was sorry for what he did, but his words rang hollow while his client sat next to him like a monument to man’s vindictiveness and cruelty.
Everything I read, and everyone I spoke with all had the same thing to say; Nicolette Lyons-Redd was a beautiful person who loved her life and her family. If she was your friend, she made you feel like the most important person in the world. She doted on her kids, and it looked like she had finally found real happiness with her new husband, Joe Reed.
When she saw that Andrew Guerrero was a danger to herself and her children, she did everything in her power to protect herself and them from him. But the evil, angry, vindictive son of a bitch still got to her. I’ve seen way too much of these types of crimes – angry, immature men who can’t accept that a relationship is over. They beg and plead, email and phone, cajole and threaten, in an escalating pattern of stalking and harassment that almost always ends up in either extreme violence or death for the woman.
My question is this; why can’t these ticking time bombs be locked up BEFORE the inevitable explosion. Protective orders are worthless pieces of paper to men like this – try using a sheet of paper as a bulletproof vest and see how far that gets you. I find these stories so frustrating personally because, like most of you, I can see the climax coming way before it happens, and I hate that helpless feeling I get when I know how the story’s going to end.
People who were close to Nicolette Lyons-Reed know exactly how that feels, and sadly, they had to see the entire scenario play out. For their sakes, and for the sakes of both Nicolette and Leah, I hope Andrew Guerrero’s stay in prison is long, lonely, and very, very painful.
I want to thank Devin B. for her invaluable assistance in the writing on this story. Besides supplying me with most of the photographs you see (which I couldn’t find anywhere else, and believe me, I looked everywhere), she gave me background information on Nicolette Lyons-Reed the person, her relationship with Andrew Guerrero, and her life with her new husband, Joe Reed. It’s not an easy or safe thing to do to show a stranger what your broken heart feels like, but Devin was able to do that too, and I was able to do a better write up because of it. I just hope I was able to do justice to this story with whatever talent for writing I’ve been given.
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57 Comments »
something should really be done about restraining orders. they don’t do anything for women when the angry man shows up at their house. it’s really a shame that restraining orders can’t be enforced in a more concrete manner, that seems to be the whole problem with these angry douchebags.
Abbey- everything I keep reading in these stories leads me to think one of two things- either restraining orders CAUSE violence, or that by the time they are executed things are already too far gone.
That said, there’s also the possibility that restraining orders are useless because they aren’t enforced and do nothing other than to infuriate the violent person, inciting them to violence. I know I wouldn’t be too happy to have a court order essentially saying my behaviour was bad- but I’m not really the spouse-killing, child-killing type, and therefore don’t have any restraining orders against me.
Everyone seems to think that restraining orders are so easy to get- but read the stories. How many dead people had restraining orders denied? How many HAD restraining orders and died?
If I was in a violent situation, after reading these stories, the last thing I’d do is file a restraining order.
Well, actually, I would, but you get my point.
c
Honestly, how would you fix it? Have a cop come with the paper 24/7? There really is no fix that would work if the person is killed. If they aren’t, lots of jail time. If they get killed, lots of jail time.
You are right. Restraining orders are unenforcable unless an officer stations themselves in your driveway 24/7. Their only use is as a paper trail if you get injured or murdered.
c
I think it could be solved like this: hire a bodygaurd for each person in potential danger from the creep at his expense….garnish his damn wages, put a freeze on his bank account, deny him any social services, whatever needs to be done until he complies with the order 100%. Further, make his ass relocate to the other side of the country.
Normally I’m all eager to jump at these guys – but this story feels a little lacking. I’m somewhat confused as to what he was like before the divorce – if it was really fear of him (hold back on what he was like for a moment) or just a mistake of marriage that caused his wife to divorce him. Seeing that she got sole custody of their son suggests he had a history of some sort of violence… yet, calling the police when your ex leaves you flowers seems confusing to me, just a bit. Was he that much of a stalker – or did she refuse to talk to him, by any extent? He doesn’t seem like he wanted to take no for an answer – but just the slippery way she moved – filing while he was oversea, calling the police (which, considering if he was that violent before-hand, is a very vital and safe move – better safe than sorry) when he leaves flowers… it just confuses me a bit. Was he violent or did he just have a forceful personality? Did he abuse her before the divorce, or did their personalities just clash and she wanted a fresh start? It seems… almost passive-aggressive, the way it worked out. On her part, I mean. I’m not suggesting she is at fault for the horrible thing that happened, but I can’t help but feel that there seems to be some sort of build up – your wife disappearing on you, your son torn from you, isolated and the stress of serving in the war… I’m not so sure if he was meant to be a murderer like this or if they pulled each other towards this spot in their own way. Thus, I don’t know if he should have been locked up before, as a “ticking time bomb.”
As it stands, though, he is guilty of horrible crimes – murdering innocent children – and I hope he dies for it. But something tells me that he is so far gone that death does not scare him – his life has already ended. In that case, I don’t think justice can ever be properly served.
I thought I was pretty clear about that at the beginning of the story, but perhaps not. According to my sources, Andrew began to get verbally, emotionally, and physically abusive almost from the start of their marriage. It intensified after Seth was born. Nicolette tried to get him to go for counseling to control his anger, but it seems he refused. If you reread what her parent said, they both were aware of how much Nicolette was afraid of Andrew. That’s why she chose to file for divorce while he was deployed in Afghanistan.
The reason she told her neighbors to call the police if they saw him at her house was that he was violating a standing protective order every time he went there. I also thought I made that clear in the very next paragraph, but again, I’m not the reader.
I hope I answered some of your questions here – if you have any more, feel free to let me know.
I understood that 100% Max.
You know that I am as hard on stupid women as I am on scumbag ex-’s and I felt nothing but horror and sympathy for this poor woman. It sounds to me like she tried to stick it out, being young and having a baby with this piece of excrement, but eventually came to her senses.
One part of the story that I find significant after a few of the recent stories featured on PYSIH, is that she grabbed her son and ran. She didn’t leave her child as she tried to save her own ass. Who could imagine – EVER – no matter how big a shitball a man was, that he could shoot a tiny infant? Nicolette’s brain must have been like cotton then, and she still grabbed her son.
Guys like this make me want to petition for cruel and unusual punishment. Painful and slow.
Poor Seth. I just hope to God that his grandparents get him serious therapy. What that little boy witnessed will haunt him (consciously or subconsciously) forever.
Justice can most definitely be served….if he’s not afraid of death, then fine. Don’t kill him. Sever his spine up near his neck so the piece of shit spends the rest of his life as a quadriplegic pissing into a bag and having someone help him shit and wipe his ass. Preferably his family. Brand his forehead with the words “Baby Killer”.
Then warn every other POS-wannabe out there that this is what will happen to them if they commit a crime like this.
Fuck the death penalty. There are worse things than death.
A-fucking-MEN!!!!!!
The thing about the death penalty- the reason why I absolutely, unequivocally and unapologetically support it- is that it’s the ONLY way to be completely sure someone like this bastard NEVER hurts anyone again.
There’s only one prison that no one can ever escape from, or be paroled from, and that’s a grave.
Lettuce,
I have to be a loud mouth here and say…are you kidding me? If your wife wnats to divorce you, it doesn’t matter why and surely you don’t start stalking her and violating an order of protection by leaving flowers, emails and calling her. The burden of proof was on her to get the restraining order, so obviously the judge saw a signifigant threat.
I can’t see how any of his prior behavior would even be relevant. I see what you are saying, but who the hell cares how he percieved it. Too effin’ bad for him. There are lots of honorable soldiers who go through much worse and don’t shoot an 8 month old point blank and thats the only thing we need to know.
This guy doesn’t derserve a chance, and I hope, I hope they put what he did to that baby on blast in his ward of the prison. Then I hope they put him with a very lonely, burly man who finds soft looking, men in uniform appealing and his name soon becomes Andrea instead of Andre if you catch my drift. And I hope it happens over and over again, till he can’t see straight and eventually begs to do a service to society and be put out of his misery for being a coward, a disgrace and a murderer.
Lettuce, I understand where you are coming from – SORT OF, but you miss the entire point. I doesn’t MATTER. Women are not the property of men, no matter what. If he was the world’s greatest guy and she was “doing” the football team, it is no justification for him to harm her, stalk her, torment her, or whatever. Period. (On second thought – amend that to “possible justification” if he walked in and saw her with the football team and flipped out. That’s what temporary insanity defenses are for.)
So, lets say that she was just a selfish bitch who hooked up with some better guy and decided to dump her hubby. So? That is what words are for. That’s when the ex is supposed to go drink with his buddies and talk shit about her. He can use that story to get sympathy from new women he meets. He can trash her with his family, or go bitch to a counselor.
Now, if they had a healthy marriage to begin with, is there any reason that she would have dumped his ass ASAP after he left? I doubt it. Unless she was simply a bitch (see previous paragraph). But most young mothers who’s husbands ship out are terrified FOR their man. They support him as he supports our nation, and if they think about divorce, they wait till he’s home. She didn’t.
As for him, if he felt shafted about their son, there are legal options. No question. We have a man who, on paper, seems to be good father material. He was married to the mother, he was a soldier. He would not have been denied partial custody or at least full visitation, unless he had a long history of violence or other criminal behavior.
So, long story short, her right to divorce him was unequivocal, her right to refuse contact with him was also OK. No matter what, no matter how. If HE used these excuses to justify his own bad behavior, then that is a fault with him. Most healthy men would say “good fucking riddance” if the woman was really a sneaky bitch. But I think that the story is probably more accurate, and she really was a terrified young woman, who unfortunately married a monster.
Lettuce- what you’ve written disturbs me. You seem to have a problem understanding what abusive is.
Getting flowers from someone that you have a restraining order against IS abusive because it blatantly shows they have no regard for the law- restraining orders prohibit people from coming into contact with or being near people or their homes.
Not only that, but anyone, including serial killers, can give people flowers. Does it mean they aren’t serial killers?
Only overly patriotic people will care that she filed while he was overseas. We don’t have a draft. He CHOSE to serve, away from his family, overseas. Sometimes the best way, the only way, to deal with abusive people is to ACT when they are not around to kill you for it. It’s a little safer, you know?
Can you not see that breaking a court order to stay away from someone, and then leaving flowers on their porch is a little scary? Does giving flowers or leaving a note, or saying ‘boo hoo, I’m sorry for being abusive’ mean that they are not abusive, not someone to be scared of, and not someone who will kill you, your unborn child, your child with the non-abuser (yet not the child WITH the abuser)?
Giving gifts to people that do not want them is abusive, even if you have no restraining order against them.
It is sad that this poor woman did everything right, and still was murdered. She didn’t put the PENIS before her children’s welfare. She filed with the authorities. She went on with her life. And now there is a woman, her unborn child, her child- all dead. And there’s a kid with no mother, a dad in prison for murder, and a father with a dead child, a dead wife and a dead unborn child. How in the word you could have sympathy escapes me.
It’s funny, because last night I was reading Dr. Seuss to my children, and this one page jumped out at me-
“I do not like
This one so well.
All he does is Yell, yell, yell.
I will not have this one about.
When he comes in
I put him out.
This one is
Quiet as a mouse.
I like to have him
In the house.’
And it made me think of all the women who stay in abusive relationships. Then I read this- She DID put him out. Sometimes it seems like you just can’t win for losing.
Anyways- read up on abusive relationships, because you don’t seem to understand anything about them.
c
OMG! Glorybug is back!!! I’m so happy, this is the first comment I’ve seen from you in awhile!! YAY
ahem…I read what Lettuce said and understood it. Didn’t agree, but I read it as…was it forseen (which it was) before she divorced him. Was she the reason teh time bomb exploded? Sure, does that lessen it at all? No way.
Kenny- How nice of you to notice! I’ve been lurking, just haven’t been posting.
c
Under the federal “Violence Against Women Act” anyone convicted of misdemeanor domestic violence and or subject to a civil protection/restraining order due to battery, they are PROHIBITED from possessing a weapon (gun). Why does the government even bother enacting these laws if they have no intention of enforcing it? The same could be said for restraining orders/civil protection orders. It is an exercise in futility, and these attempts to protect and serve aren’t worth the paper they are written on.
This beautiful young lady and her sweet little baby died such a horrible death. Also, what kind of a scumbag would subject his own child to these horrific events? I can understand how scared she must have felt to go through all the motions of getting a restraining order. When you finally feel that you have to get a restraining order on someone, you have gotten to the point that you are so scared that you feel that you have no other choice. I wish restraining orders were worth more than the paper their printed on….I guess it depends upon the state laws and the law enforcement in the area and how they handle it when you have to call the police. Some cops have a 0% policy and will haul these stalkers in, but others will let these stalkers talk and weasel their way out of being charged. I went through this situation & had one, but this guy didn’t care. When he broke into my house & killed my dog, I packed up and moved my daughter & I back in with my parents. He never got charged because his dad was a cop with the department. Sorry to get off subject (I know I ramble on a lot!) My heart is breaking for her husband, Joe Reed. He goes to work and comes home to his entire family ripped from him. He lost his wife, his daughter, and his soon to be baby, and his stepson Seth will now be sent to live with grandparents. I think that should let Joe Reed be alone with Guerrero for 30 minutes unsupervised. Let Guerrero try to defend himself against someone his own size! I hate it when they let these scumbags plead guilty just so they won’t get the death penalty. Why should he get to live out the rest of his life (even if it is in prison)? Because we have way to many bleeding hearts that feel sorry for this piece of garbage. I bet these bleeding hearts would be singing a different tune if this were their family members. My sincere condolences go out to Joe Reed, Robert Lyons, Eva Lyons, and little Seth. I will keep you in my thoughts and prayers. RIP Nicolette, Leah, and little unborn angel. May you each rest in peace and never feel pain again….
This story makes me want to vomit… The only thing Restraining Orders are good for is the paper trail.
That’s why she wanted the police called… because if you don’t have a stinking paper trail the length of your fucking city, the judges don’t care and won’t do shit about it.
This makes me sick…
You are so right. After reading so many of these cases, it seems like once a restraining order is finally granted it’s only purpose is to say ‘If I’m found murdered, this person probably killed me’.
What is the point of having a restraining order if it isn’t even enforced? Obviously they don’t scare most murderers.
c
My heart goes out to Joe Reed for the loss of his family. Words can not express the deep sorrow and sympathy that I feel for this young man to have suffered the loss of his beautiful wife and children. I hope that little Seth has the love and support of his family to help him come to terms with what the sperm donor did to his mother and sister.
Perhaps my liberal tendencies are showing, but wouldn’t the solution here be to make a restraining order also serve to suspend an offender’s 2nd amendment rights?
I think guns should be owned by people, for the mutual defense of the state and that every citizen should be prepared to defend their nation and neighbors and so be armed to the best of their income and abilities, but a restraining order is put in place to blunt the danger one person represents to another and to give actionable means to a Law Enforcement Officer in the case of its breach. I think that a restraining order by definition should be a restraint on the citizen, especially when those orders are by their nature temporary.
In this case she should have been able to take out a restraining order against him. She could prove prior violence and a judge, should be able at a simple hearing, be able to force the husband, until the completion of the order, to surrender his firearms.
As an added note, it almost seems like if the ex-wife were armed and her ex-husband were not, then she’d have a reasonable way of defending herself and you could even document how it could be handled. If he breaks the restraining order, she can shoot her legal firearm, with the assumption that he is coming to kill her or do bodily harm.
Make a restraining order a clear and present reminder that it is a license to kill in self-defense and add to it a disarmament clause for the one being restrained, and I think we have something with enough teeth to make someone think.
Jason, it’s been awhile since I read the old restraining orders, but unless I’m completely mistaken (which has happened upon occasion) the fine print says you are supposed to TURN IN ANY GUNS you might have to the authorities.
Meaning jackass obviously wasn’t planning on cooperating with any little piece of the order.
Also it wouldn’t have stopped him from say… stabbing her to death. But I agree that her having a gun and the gumption to use it might have saved three lives. =(
Again, this story makes me sick…
Ah… North Carolina DVPO’s don’t take their guns away… I think California may be rare here, perhaps with the exception of some other states
In California, a domestic violence restraining order requires that the perpetrator turn in all guns in their possession to the police, who hold them until the court orders the guns released. The restrained person is not allowed to have a gun (even for hunting or sport) while the restraining order is in effect. Of course, this does not stop the restrained person from obtaining another gun and blowing the victim’s head off.
Jason,
If you read my post below, it kind of covers your questions…
kdb27 says:
June 11, 2009 at 6:48 am
Under the federal “Violence Against Women Act” anyone convicted of misdemeanor domestic violence and or subject to a civil protection/restraining order due to battery, they are PROHIBITED from possessing a weapon (gun). Why does the government even bother enacting these laws if they have no intention of enforcing it? The same could be said for restraining orders/civil protection orders. It is an exercise in futility, and these attempts to protect and serve aren’t worth the paper they are written on.
I’m tired of reading stories like this, not of PYSIH posting them, but that it keeps happening to scared, powerless women & their children because the law can’t protect them.
Ihave to say that this story cuts me so deep… and because of our failed justice system, stories like these are exactly the reason that so many women are afraid to leave abusive relationships. How can you really find the lesser of two evils when it comes to that?? Do I stay with him and risk my life, or do I leave, move on and risk mine and my new families life? Knowing the courts can’t do shit to protect you gives you little or no comfort. So many of us stay… and pray for a better solution, or pray for change.
I think parents need to raise their kids to handle Anger, Disappointment, and Lose better.
I will bet that Andrew’s parents weren’t around much and that he never learned how to deal with loss or failure.
LOL, agreed. Of course, if the parents themselves can’t control themselves then we have a situation that can’t be won…
I wonder if this is in the future of the little boy crying his eye out at TBall (then pouting very clearly for the rest of the game and refusing to partiipate) because he got an “out”….?
I agree! Or he’ll get an out and Dad will come down on him about not trying hard enough, blah blah blah, and Little Timmy will run home and decapitate the neighborhood cat.
My little cousin’s dad (my Uncle) was so hard on him whenever he would mess up he would cry. He’s in high school and still talks to a cry counselor.
Not to sound like a conspiracy nut, but it’s almost like the “ticking time bombs” serve a purpose for somebody. Rather than remove such from society and place them in a big building far away – aka State Mental / Lunatic Hospitals like was done 100 years ago, the system wants to treat EVERYONE like a ticking time bomb and disarm us all. The real problem with that is that such ticking time bombs would then go for a knife, bat, hammer, nail gun, etc… Also there were always cases of those who should not have been locked up……
It’s a real shame that this story won’t have a decent ending, this POS avoided the death penalty.
Also there is a class of people who kust think that any weapon makes them superior to everyone else around them. I was riding a city bus and a POS thought his shit did not stink because he had brass knuckles. His shit started to stink when i put my can of pepper spray between his eyes……
Fred- I’m not a gun person. Guns really have only one purpose, and that is to kill things. I’m vegetarian- ’nuff said.
That said, I do believe we have the right to own guns, and that the original purpose of that right was not so much to defend ourselves against evil murderers, but to defend ourselves against our own government.
I don’t think this story has anything to do with gun ownership other than that maybe crazy murderous people should not be allowed to have any. But crazy people also should not be allowed to have knifes, screwdrivers or rope.
None of this would have happened if people respected restraining orders, if they had any teeth. But they don’t. Restraining orders are laughable, and as was previously said, only serve as a homicide paper trail.
The real crime is that laws were changed in the 80’s regarding treatment and restraint of 5150s in mental institutions…. all for the purpose of meeting governmental budgets. I won’t name that president.
c
HAHA I’ve noticed something just HYSTERICAL about the county mental health places… you see… if they feel that the individual is not a threat to himself or others, they let them out… =)
Of course, once that happens the person stops taking their meds and goes back to talking to themselves and rocking back and forth while frothing at the mouth. And I am talking about a specific case I’ve seen and what I heard from talking to the police involved in the situation.
They REALLY REALLY SHOULD FIX THAT.
I know this story all too well.. It happened in my family..
taken from a website – http://www.mayhem.net/Crime/murder2.html
Larry Dame (5) – On October 20, 2000, Police in Minnesota have arrested an ex-convict Lawrence Scott Dame for the murders of his sister, her husband and their three young children. Dame, had been released the day before the killings from the Anoka County jail where he was being held for allegedly stealing one of the family’s cars.The victims were identified as Donna Mimbach, 29; her husband, Todd Mimbach, 32; and their children, Daniel Mimbach, 22 months; Amber Duval, 9, and John Mimbach, 12. The bodies were found in the family’s suburban Minneapolis home after a concerned co-worker of the father’s called police because he hadn’t shown up to work.
The Star Tribune of Minneapolis reported that as a condition of his release, Dame was supposed to report to a hospital for a mental health crisis intervention. Don Ilse, director of field services for Anoka County Community Corrections, told the newspaper that Dame spoke with a mental health professional at the hospital. Family members said they unsuccessfully tried admitting Dame to the hospital. Hannah Dame told the Pioneer Press her son had been acting strangely and recently claimed to hear voices. She quoted her son as saying, “The spirits said your family is going to kill you. Well, I better kill everyone before they kill me.”
Police said that Donna Mimbach called Lino Lakes police for help the night before she and her family were killed by her brother. “We did everything legally possible to assist Donna Mimbach on the night of October 18,” said Lino Lakes Police Chief Dave Pecchia addressing the fact that officers could not legally arrest Larry S. Dame from her home unless she evicted him. According to the police report the morning after Dame beat the Mimbach family with a hammer and stabbed all but his sister with a kitchen knife as they slept.
According to friends Donna loved her brother. Their other brother, Walter Dame, 23, said Larry drank to quiet the voices. The voices told Larry Dame that his family was out to kill him because they were trying to commit him to a mental hospital, his brother said. Dame had been jailed for a week this month after taking one of the Mimbachs’ cars. He was released the day before the killings. Todd and Donna Mimbach picked him up at the jail late that afternoon. After taking his wife home, Todd Mimbach took Dame to Mercy Hospital in Coon Rapids hoping to have Dame admitted to the hospital. Instead, Dame was sent back to the Mimbach home.
At 9:26 p.m. Donna called 911 for help: “Um, it’s regarding, OK my brother got discharged from the um jail today and the consequences were that he was supposed to go to the hospital because he hears voices and he stole my car and all this stuff. My husband brought him to the hospital and the hospital will not take him, and so my husband is bringing him back here because we can’t get ahold of his parole officer. Well, I can’t have him stay here. He has to go back to jail or something.” The next day, after relatives could not gain access to the house, police were called and the massacre was discovered
One more thing.. The whole incident has scarred a part of my family forever.. I wasn’t close enough to be devastated by what happened, but I’m close enough to that part of my family to see what destruction it did.. No one is ever the same after this sort of thing happens.. No one.. A lawsuit was filed by the victem’s family, and I can tell you they won.. but what is money after something like this?? It means absolutely nothing.. SO much could have been done.. and it just wasn’t..
I agree with you about the story not being about gun rights, BUT the people who want to take away guns will use this story as another reason.
Our country’s founders initial government was so close to anarchy (Articles of Confederation which I was taught little about) that a second government was created……. Many history classes seem to leave a gap between 1776 when the Declaration of Independence was written and 1789 when the Constitution was written….
So I totally agree that the Second Ammendment was for the people to have control over the government…….
BUT if the government can not protect the people, insure the right to life, then the Second Ammendment gets stretched because the government is no longer doing its job to protect life.
Well said, Fred.
But I’m one of the people the pro-gun lobbyists hate. I’m all for gun ownership to protect oneself from evil murderers and our own government, but against ownership for the purpose of killing defenseless animals for fun and sport. Oh, and I’m against evil, murderous people having them. But they will probably always find a way to get them, which is why I’m for restrictions on felons and people with restraining orders, even if they’re unenforcable. I’m even more for involuntary institutionalization of crazy people.
T
iltiing against winidmills and all that.
c
I’m with you Glory (except the hunting part – I personally won’t kill living creatures, but so long as the hunters eat what they kill, I can’t fault it). I will take it one step further though. I think that we need to punish illegal gun holders so harshly that they will think twice about it. Or if they don’t think twice, at least they won’t be a threat to law-abiding citizens. These days, it seems as if the system has just decided that it is to overwhelming to deal with, and unless there is a felony crime attached to the gun, the criminal is slapped on the wrist and sent back to the streets to get another one.
I am SICK of it. I want to see the illegal gun owners in jail for 10-15 years of REAL time. The way I see it is these guys break the law with impunity, they use the law breaking activity to break more laws and intimidate others. There is no good that can come from an illegal gun, or the illegal gun owner. So – slap their asses in jail and keep them off the streets. I don’t give a crap about rehabilitating them, I want the rest of us to be safe.
However, I have a greater chance of survival when defending myself against rope and knives than I do a gun…
Fred, you kind of sound like a ticking time bomb yourself, if you don’t mind me saying….
To a degree yes.
I have worked some jobs and I have seen what type of scum that is out there.
I worked as a cashier in a parking garage, and it’s amazing how people want XYZ, and get it free…..
Also I did shut off for a gas company. Most of the people I was shutting off were not poor, they were people who were usingthe gas in someone else’s name……..
I have also been the victim of people who abused the system…. and now my daughter is one herself. Screw with me and I will enjoy screwing you back, screw with my daughter or ANY of my loves ones, and you have an enemy who waits for the time to strike.
Look you can have them turn in guns and knives and what ever other paraphelia they have but until we can change the laws if they violate the restraining order by contacting them the first time they should be arrested. Period this way there is no way they can go back and kill their ex wives girlfriends etc.
Great write up! Written from the heart. The picture at the bottom I assume is Seth. What a heartbreaking photo! Bless that poor little child.
wow, as many times as i’ve read stories like this, this one really hit me hard. this poor, poor woman. she only tried to do right by her family and look where it got her. the courts really do need to start being more proactive in protecting women like this. its disgusting that a man has to kill or maim before they are thrown in jail. i keep thinking too, her poor husband, i bet he feels guilty for not being there :(
Andrew is a pathetic excuse for a man, and a human being. fucking coward.. i hope he gets his in prison, lucky for us, men who abuse women are pretty low on that totem pole, prob. just above child abusers/molesters.
For those of you who have not experienced the joy of an abusive relationship, here are some warning signs that your beloved is in actuality nuts and may kill you when you try to get away:
1. Has a substance abuse problem in which they turn from Jekyll to Hyde.
2. Freaks out if you even hint of dating someone else.
3. Starts to show up unannounced after work to say “hi!”
4. Goes bananas at the mention of someone else you were dating.
5. Makes a big show of “solving your problems” for you without you asking.
6. Does everything they can to make you more dependent upon them.
7. Moves into your house as soon as humanly possible.
After moving in/marrying you:
1. Begins going through your phone/cellphone messages and demanding to know who they are from.
2. Listens in to your phone calls.
3. Goes ballistic over wrong number calls, insinuating you are seeing someone.
4. Opens and goes through your mail “accidentally.”
5. Times your grocery store runs and then says, “That took you way too long. Where did you really go?”
6. Times your arrival home from work by the second.
7. Makes it perfectly apparent to all your friends that he/she hates them.
8. Resents any time whatsoever that you spend outside the house without them.
9. Begins to take control of all finances, giving you an “allowance”, all in the name of “saving.”
10. Makes life relentlessly miserable for you if you don’t do it “their way.”
11. Verbally abuses you, then apologizes.
Critical stage:
1. Begins to physically abuse you, sending you to the doctor.
2. Does not let you leave the house without them, then acts like a violent lunatic in public if you are even so much as looked at by someone of the opposite sex.
3. Insists that you are having an affair, especially when they’re drunk or high.
4. Throws tantrums, specifically destroying sentimental items you love.
5. Degrades you verbally in public.
6. Goes crazy if you voice the intention to go visit your friends or family. Your friends are all “whores,” “sluts” or “drug addicts;” your family members are all “losers” and “assholes”.
7. Attempts to get you fired from your job, to get you to quit your job, or conversely, to give them all the money you make from your job, so that you have no financial resources.
8. Takes away or disables your mode of transportation.
When you leave:
1. Literally canvasses the city on foot or by car, looking for you.
2. Sits outside your work, waiting for you. Sits outside your friends’ houses, waiting for you. Sits outside your family’s houses, waiting for you.
3. Calls you endlessly, begging you to come back, until you change your phone number.
4. Contacts people they “think” you had an affair with and threatens to kill them.
5. Empties any joint bank accounts and steals any money from you they can.
6. Relentlessly stalks you. As time goes by, destroys anything of yours that they have in their possession.
7. Begins outright threatening you with physical harm.
8. Threatens suicide, saying they can’t live without you.
9. Buys a gun and shoots you, reasoning that you have destroyed their life and now you need to be destroyed in turn.
Welcome to my world. Come on in. The water’s warm. And for all you Monday morning quarterbacks, let’s play, “At what point do you think the restraining order would change things?” Clue: When they get out of jail for stalking you under the jurisdiction of the restraining order, they’re so man they’re heading directly over to your pad to blow your head off. They should come with a warning label: EFFECTIVE ONLY AGAINST NORMAL HUMAN BEINGS.
Wow. You have hit on almost every variable. You didn’t include anything about their treatment of your children.
And you missed this big warning sign- they quite obviously act as if they don’t love you. Because when they’re doing all that shit there’s no tiime to make nice.
None of my previous relationships had ever been abusive, so I was kind of hit by a fencepost by my ex. Very confused since I had no pattern of that before. But you pretty much hit every point. Luckily he’s now my ex. And a few years later I have a great partner. Unluckily I still have to deal with the ex as he’s our children’s father.
I’m going to guess you have personal experience with this- if not, I’m impressed. I’d like to use your list on my website. Please let me know if that’s ok. I’ll give you credit.
c
Sure, you can use it. This is my present reality. I don’t have experience with children inside an abusive relationship, other to say that the abuser DID drive all of my teenage children out of the house within two years. I did have the luck to participate in the Fifteen Year Long Custody Battle. But that’s another story.
“man” = mad
Back to work. The boss looks pissed off that nothing’s getting done.
I’d like to add that as far as restraining CA, I have no faith iin them.
With my ex, police were called on several different occasions by myself and our neighbors. Each time the responding officers told my ex and me that even though I owned my house free and clear before we married, that because we were married I could not prohiibit him from being there. So essentially each time the police were tellinig him he had rights to be in my house- UNLESS he physically assaulted me and I could prove it with witnesses. He learned very quickly not to physiically assault me. He did just fine with the verbal and emotional abuse. I would never have been able to get a restraining order unless he beat the shit out of me in front of people. Which wouldn’t have mattered, because people like him (and they’re not all gangsters and hoodlums- lots of them are whiite-collars like my ex) have no respect for the law anyway.
Later, during our divorce, I found out that none of the police had filed their reports. They don’t have to if there’s no further action. So, I get divorced because eventually my ex began abusing our children, but I can’t get any custody restrictions because there is no record of abuse. Now I get to hear lovely things like my eldest being thrown against a wall while at their dad’s house- but I can’t do anything because it’s all hearsay on the children’s part. The house is clean because he’s rich and pays for housekeepers. CPS won’t go anywhere near that. It isn’t just poor trailerpark people- rich people abuse their chiildren just as often as anyone else. They just get away with it more often.
As an afterthought- I DID tell my family and friends what was happening, and essentially they either faded away, or they told me to try harder. After about the 5th marital counselor, I threw in the towel. Best decision I ever made.
c
Hey lady,
I’m not familiar with the particulars of your case, but I’ve been doing the Custody Dance for the past five years now. One thing you want to do is take notes of when your children tell you these things, time and date, and if you have visitation with them and there are bruises take pictures. Take note of how they do in school and stay involved. If their grades start dipping, the mediators take that as an indication that the children are not doing well. If you do manage to get anything, or even if you don’t I’d suggest you talk to a family lawyer. Even if there is nothing you can do about custody or if you are happy with the situation you have, you could EASILY force this man into anger management and parenting classes which MIGHT ACTUALLY HELP.
Again, I don’t know the situation but the court will be glad to assign those things regardless.
Also when was this??? My understanding from the police is that they follow the rule of : if there is any abuse, someone has to get arrested. How odd =(
I have posted what you wrote here- http://glorybug-thebigpicture.blogspot.com/
Please let me know how you would like to be credited.
c
Just goes to show that even a peice of paper won’t stop the ruthless.
I agree that there needs to be something done about restraining orders.
There needs to be harsher laws, like six months jail time for just violating an order and in the most extreme of cases the victim should be placed in the witness protection program.
Might be too much to ask but we gotta do something.
Three lives were taken that day.
What I was thinking this whole time is that the military should do something about a soldier that gets a restraining order placed against them. I mean the military can make a cheating spouse go to a marriage counselor and will pitch a fit if someone starts getting their material things repossed but in a situation like this they don’t do anything when a wife claims that a soldier is abusive? That doesn’t make a whole lot of sense to me.
The majority of the branches of the military DO investigate these claims and if the claims are legit, the perp will be apprehended. As a Navy Police Officer myself, I have assisted in sending the moron servicemembers who abuse their families to the brig on more than one occasion. The army is a little behind in victim protection. But if Nicollette (not to blame her) had notified NCIS of her past, they have an agreement with most local law enforcement agencies and could have kept a better eye on her.
Why can’t we use technology to make restraining orders more effective? What if the offender was required to wear some sort of non-removable GPS tracking device that would produce an alarm when he comes within a specified distance from the person who filed the restraining order (who would also have a GPS device on her person at all times)? This way a woman living in fear would have advance warning, hopefully enough time to leave her home and go somewhere safe, and the police would have advance warning of the attempted confrontation as well as proof that the restraining order was broken.
I went to high school with both of them, but I was Nicolette’s friend. It still to this day is hard to believe that this happened. I wish there was something I could do to bring her back. She was a wonderful person & given the oppurtunity, you would think so too.