UPDATE: Diane Schuler
WITNESS FROM CRASH SCENE POSTS ESSAY ON CRAIGSLIST
I received an email from a person who calls themselves ZF informing me of an essay posted by a person who had pulled up to the scene of the Taconic Parkway accident that killed eight people a few minutes after it happened, describing what he saw. This person happens to be a talented writer, and his description of the horrific goings on are both disturbing and haunting.
The point of posting this essay is this; If this doesn’t get the point across about why minimizing what Diane Schuler did is such an evil thing to do, I don’t think anything ever will. The description of the man standing by his car, weeping inconsolably over the things he has just seen, brought it home to me that this isn’t about Diane or Diane’s reputation, it’s about the tragic loss of innocent lives and the effect that’s had on all sorts of people, from the immediate family to total strangers.
The one good thing I took from this person’s story was the number of people who got involved. It sounded like dozens and dozens of strangers took it upon themselves to help, whether it was pulling the children from the burning van or performing CPR or just offering comfort to the people who became overwhelmed by what they saw. It was humanity at its best.
Date: 2009-08-05, 1:46AM EDT
Driver in N.Y. wreck that killed 8 was intoxicated
I’m sure other people on this board must have seen it as well. I was driving home from my summer house upstate. There was a 10 minute rain storm so everyone slowed down, then the rain stopped and everyone sped up again…. Suddenly about a mile from the turn to get on the Sawmill, cars just stopped . Brake lights as far as I could see. Stopped in the middle of a three lane highway. There were trees in the median between the north and southbound lanes, and behind the tress was a huge, black plume of smoke going up into the sky. I was on a motorcycle, so I could go between the cars and move up to see what happened. Once I came around the bend, off to the side of the southbound lane, a mini van was upside down, completely engulfed in flames. I could feel the heat from the flames as I pulled by. Hundreds of people were running from both sides of the North and South lanes of the Taconic. I pulled over and got off my bike, and try to take in what was happening.
The burning mini van was popping and sparking every once in a while, I assume something inside was making small explosions as they caught fire. I pulled behind a white van on the side of the highway, a Chinese man got out and was talking to me but frankly I cant remember a word we said to each other. About 20 feet from the burning mini van, there were clusters of people kneeling around what I assumed were the crash victims. Every 10 feet or so, there was another cluster, kneeling down.
Each one had a person pumping the chest of the victims while the other people were helping any way the can. Everyone was running with they’re cellphones screaming frantically.I noticed what looked like a station wagon, across the median. The entire front was smashed to the point where you wondered where the hell the engine could have gone. it looked like the cars front began at the front seat. I noticed the cluster of people closest to me, probably 15 feet away, and I saw a pair of tiny blue shorts, and small legs sticking out from the group of people. I knew it was a child, and as the father of a 6 year old daughter, I knew it was a girl. I couldn’t see her face, only her blue shorts and her legs. Nothing was moving. A man in a white shirt was pumping her chest, and screaming for help. I thought for a moment of walking over to see what i could do, but it was so chaotic, and there were so many people already. People just abandoned their cars on the highway and ran to help. I looked at her legs, and there wasn’t a scratch on them. I looked at the man pumping her chest, with the white shirt on. Every so often he’d turn to scream something, and there was no blood on the front of his shirt. I thought about what she may have looked like from the waist up, and I’m really glad I never got to see her face.
There was one cop there when I arrived, and you could see on her face, that she was really freaking out. She must have just pulled up before I got there and was assessing the situation. I’ll never forget the look of panic on her face. One man ran passed us and got a first aid kit out of his trunk. All this happened in probably 4 minutes. Now you could hear people screaming to get back in they’re cars because the fire engines couldn’t get through. The fire engine was stuck behind all the cars on the Northbound side. Sirens and lights wailing. An EMS guy jumped from the fire truck and started running towards the scene, screaming into his walkie-talkie.
I noticed a man leaning against his car weeping. Total strangers were coming up to him and hugging him, and by his body language and his movements of what he was describing, I knew he was one of the people that pulled these kids out of that burning car. He was inconsolable. So were the people hugging him. I got back on my motorcycle, and turned on to the Sawmill, back to NY. I saw her legs and blue shorts over and over again. I could not get them out of my head. I pulled over a mile down the road, got of my bike and starting crying harder then I’ve cried in a long time. I’ve been a New Yorker for 23 years. It takes a lot to shock or disturb us, but holy shit, this disturbed me.
It was a horrible thing to see. It’s effected me in a surprising way, still is a week later. I have a daughter, and the thought of course thats been running through my head, along with the never ending vision of those little blue shorts, and pale white legs, not moving, it could have been her. In my dreams when i see the man in the white shirt pumping her chest, I walk over and see my daughters face. Not a scratch on her, just eyes closed as if shes sleeping. I imagine thats what that little girl looked like while they were desperately trying to get her to breathe.
I rode by the spot yesterday coming back from upstate again. Theres a big chunk of earth where the mini van rolled and scorched grass where it sat and burned. I thought I saw a cross with some flowers on it , but I wasn’t sure.
As the facts come out about what really happened, and turns out this woman was drunk, and high, I’m torn between anger and incredible sadness. Anger as an adult and father, who’s sole purpose in life is to protect, and teach my child right from wrong. Anger having seen a dead child laying in the middle of the median, knowing that child was probably singing or playing with her doll, having no concept she was going the wrong way on a fucking highway, trusting her mother. Completely innocent. My God, I hope 4 those girls died on impact. Never knowing what hit them. I can honestly say, having seen that wreckage, they must have.
Sadness as a husband and father. This man will now have to explain to his only living son, what happened to his mother and his sisters one day. Not to mention the aunts and uncles of the nieces she also killed.
If anyone from these shattered families do read this, you have my deepest sympathy . Its little help but try to take some solace in the fact that hundreds, and I mean hundreds of people ran to help as best they could. It was utter chaos, but these people had the instinct and bravery to jump out of their cars, and run to a burning car to pull everyone out. They did the best they could with the little they had. It was truly inspiring……
I will NEVER get the image of those little blue shorts, and legs out of my head……I don’t have some big message to end on or a moral of any kind. I’m simply getting what I saw off my chest, though it will be with me for the rest of my life.
Thanks for listening.
Peace
911 CALLS IN WRONG-WAY CRASH REVEAL FAMILY’S ALARM
FOX NEWS
Fox 5 News has obtained recordings of phone calls that a friend of Diane Schuler‘s family made to the State Police in hopes of averting tragedy on a Sunday in July.
Schuler had been incoherent on two calls with her family made about 1 p.m., and they were worried she was in serious trouble.
On one tape, Schuler’s brother Warren Hance, who drove north from Long Island when he knew his sister was in trouble, is heard talking to the police at a nearby station house.
But all the calls came in about 20 minutes too late. Diane Schuler had already crashed her car heading the wrong way on the Taconic Parkway, killing eight people.
It took Diane Schuler 49 minutes to get from the Harriman toll plaza to the Tappan Zee Bridge, a trip that shouldn’t take more than a half hour given the traffic at the time. Did she stop somewhere else? Some say yes — perhaps at the Ramapo rest stop.
Authorities have said Schuler was drunk and high at the time of the accident. Schuler’s husband has disputed that finding.
Michael Bastardi, whose father and brother were killed in the crash, still feels the Schuler family is not telling the whole story.
The state police still haven’t released their report on the accident.
TIMELINE: DIANE SCHULER’S FINAL HOURS
by Andrea Canning, Jennifer Pereira and Lindsay Goldwert – ABC News
No charges will be filed in relation to the fatal collision last month caused by a mother — drunk and high, according to toxicology tests — who drove the wrong way down the Taconic State Parkway in New York, killing herself and seven other people, a prosecutor said.
“Diane Schuler died in the crash and the charges died with her,” Westchester County District Attorney Janet DiFiore said.
The Associated Press reported today that investigators could not find any evidence that Schuler, whose daughter and nieces were among the dead, drank alcohol or smoked marijuana before getting in the car for the 2 1/2 hour drive home from upstate New York.
Her husband had followed in a second car with the family dog and was not involved in the crash.
Schuler underwent a significant change over a small span of time that would drastically change the lives of three families, according to a private investigator hired by the Schuler family.
Tom Ruskin, the president of CMP Group Investigations, has been hard at work trying to piece together the final moments of the crash that has horrified the nation and left Schuler’s loved ones baffled.
“We’ve got multiple investigators working hundreds of hours trying to retrace her steps,” he said. “Toll receipts, cell phone records, credit card receipts.”
The timeline began at 9:30 a.m. at a campground in upstate New York. Ruskin says shortly after Schuler left for home, appearing sober, she stopped at McDonald’s.
In surveillance video captured shortly after at a gas station, Schuler appeared sober and in control, Ruskin says.
“You see Diane Schuler filling up the minivan, and then you very clearly see her entering the convenience store,” he says. “We now know that she was attempting to purchase Tylenol or Advil gel caps. Did she appear normal? Absolutely.”
At 11:37 a.m., Schuler’s niece Emma, 8, called her father, Warren Hance, Schuler’s brother, to tell him they were running late. At 12:08 p.m. the Hances called back and had what has been described as a “normal” conversation with Schuler. But over the next 48 minutes, something went terribly wrong.
At 12:56 p.m., Emma called her father back in a panic.
“What did Emma say to her dad?” Ruskin said. “She’s expressing … something is wrong with Diane. Diane is incoherent, she is confused and they are lost.”
The call dropped out and Schuler’s cell phone was later found on top of a wall by a bridge near the highway. “It means 99.9 percent sure she got out of the car,” Ruskin later said.
Schuler’s brother called the police to ask them to issue an Amber alert. But by then, it was likely too late, according to Ruskin.
The Taconic and the Toxicology Report
Twenty-five minutes after that final phone call, Schuler had already made the fatal wrong turn that would kill her and her 3-year-old daughter, her three nieces, and Guy Bastardi, his father Michael Bastardi and their friend Daniel Longo, who were riding in an oncoming SUV.
The toxicology report would later reveal that Schuler had the equivalent of 10 drinks and marijuana in her system. A bottle of vodka was found at the crash scene.
But her husband, Daniel Schuler, won’t accept that his wife was drinking.
Five-year-old Bryan Schuler, who is now in a rehab facility, was told over the weekend that he was the only survivor of the crash.
Following the toxicology reports, Schuler’s husband said his wife had left the campground, where the road trip began, completely sober.
“I don’t say that the report is accurate or not accurate,” the Schulers’ lawyer, Dominic Barbara, told “Good Morning America’s” Chris Cuomo Aug. 7, referring to the toxicology report. “What I say is that none of this case is logical.”
“Something medical had to have happened,” Barbara said in a press conference the day before.
Barbara has tried to pin the crash on a stroke caused by an underlying diabetes condition. Daniel Schuler and his attorney have said that they believe it’s possible Diane Schuler suffered a transient ischemic attack, or TIA, a mild strokelike condition that can cause disorientation.
Experts told ABCNews.com such an attack is unlikely.
“This is not typical presentation for TIAs,” Dr. Larry Goldstein, director of the Center for Cerebrovascular Disease at Duke University, said. “There are many, many other potential causes to have an alteration of behavior. TIA would not be in my top three causes.”
Previously, Barbara suggested that Schuler may have ingested alcohol in an attempt to raise a low blood sugar level, a theory experts said demonstrates a fundamental misunderstanding of both diabetes and strokes.
“There is no way that having a stroke or that diabetes prompted her to drink. There is no medical explanation that would explain that assertion,” said Dr. Aman Patel, director of the neurosurgery residency program at Mount Sinai Medical Center.
Schuler Family: ‘This Is Not the Woman They Know’
Schuler’s prolonged erratic driving suggested that she was not affected by a stroke. During the four hours she was on the road, Schuler crossed the median on the Taconic State Parkway three times and state police received a number of calls reporting her.
“This is a killing. Don’t call it an accident,” Irving Anolik, attorney for the Bastardi family, who lost a father and son in the wreck, told “Good Morning America” last week. Anolik said that any medical condition theories are “at war with the autopsy report, with the blood analysis, with the whole panorama of things that surround this killing.”
Still, Daniel Schuler insisted during the news conference that he had never seen his wife drunk and that “she was the perfect wife.”
“Do you think we’d be doing this if we thought she was an alcoholic?” Barbara asked.
Mourning family members are incredulous.
“We had an occasional pina colada at a family barbecue,” Jay Schuler, the wife of Daniel Schuler’s brother, said on “GMA.” “She was meticulous, safe, I trusted her with my son when I left the country … those three girls before her own children were her life.”
“This is absolutely not the woman they know,” she said. “[Not] who I trusted my children with.”
For those who don’t know it, Tom Ruskin is the investigator who works for the Schuler family, so no one can accuse me of being biased against the Schulers. On the contrary, I always try to be fair, and to give both sides a chance to have their say. But what I won’t do is repeat ridiculous hypothesis’ and outrageous scenarios designed to serve someone’s agenda – In this case trying to prove that Diane Schuler wasn’t drinking the day she crashed the minivan. I believe that’s unethical and immoral.
But the information in this article is excellent. It sounds to me like Mr. Ruskin’s team did a very thorough job of investigating Diane’s footsteps on the day of the tragedy. The facts were presented without any editorializing, and without any bias. This seems to be the most detailed and specific timeline of the events leading up to the head-on collision the destroyed so many lives that July afternoon.
While checking into this story, I also found out that FOX5NY got their hands on a tape of one the first 911 call from the scene of the Taconic Crash. It isn’t a source of any new information, but I find these sorts of thing important because they help to bring a tragedy alive in my mind, to make it more than just some words on a computer screen or a sheet of newsprint.
69 Comments »
Why is it always “This is not the woman I know” or “He would never do something like this” with these nutjobs?
Once, just once, I want to see the perp’s family go “Yeah, I figured she’d do something like that sooner or later”, “Had to happen at some point” or “No surprise, we all saw that one coming”.
It’d be a little more honest if nothing else.
I wouldn’t call them nutjobs. I think they’re a family who have been blind-sided by something they probably should have seen coming. I think they’re going about their attempt to acquit Diane in a rather shamelessly public forum, but I can understand their not wanting to believe that she was responsible for the crash due to her own recklessness.
Max – Glad to see this update!
I think you did and excellent job at presenting what each side is saying without letting anyone promote their agenda.
To me Diane S exhibited the behavior of an alcoholic, not someone who was confused or disoriented suddenly. I will note from personeel experience I find that people with the onset of Alzhiemer’s or other similar LONG term confusion exhibit the same behavior that she did, the fact that she appeared normal for quite some time before then suddenly did what she did tells me that she had been a secret drunk for quite some time!
If she were suddenly confused or disoriented to the point that she was, she’d have pulled over and called for help. So whatever state she was in was something NOT unusual for her, so she contunued her behavior. I have know some people who got in trouble for drunk driving, but would still have a few glasses of wine before getting behind the wheel – because “they could handle it”. I am sure that Diane has “handled” this situation before…..
if she trueky had a medical condition, seeing so many cars coming at her would have set off some type of panick to which she would have puled over, but she xhibitted the attitude of a self rightious drunk – everyone else is wrong.
Is it easy to do a wrong way on a highway – YES in some places…
Rt 9 in Meddriden / Middletown CT… there are stoplights on a highway! One could get confused thinking one side of the guard rail is the “service road” and the other side is the highway ramp…
Rt 91 Southbound has an exit that is at the end of Liberty Street in Springfield (BEHIND the bus terminal). if the DO NOT ENTER signs have been plowed down the highway exit appears to be an entrance to a parking lot or other type of road as this exit is long. I made that mistake once and quickly figured out I was wrong. I was sober, signs were twisted & missing!
In short, if Diane’s family’s theory was correct, confusion should have led to panic not belligerence.
What a horrible woman. I can’t imagine ever — EVER — being drunk/stoned/high enough to put kids at risk like that. Especially not if they were begging me to stop.
Excuse me, I have to go punch a wall or a pillow or something because I can’t punch her or her (remaining, in-denial) family members.
Stories like this make me glad I don’t drink hard alcohol any more. It would have been harder for her to drink ten beers between 11:30 and 1:15 – one hour and forty five minutes. Equally sad is that apparently for the last twenty minutes of that time the kids were terrified. Not to ever excuse what she did. Vodka is the classic alcoholic’s drink, because it’s harder to smell on your breath. I’m with the crowd that says she was a closet drinker – guzzling down that much vodka in that short of a period of time makes me think it was something she had done a number of times before.
Comment Deleted By Editor
You’re trying too hard to be an asshole, Mr. Snake. You’re over-reaching and coming off as a parody of an asshole. Pull back a bit, inject some sincerity and respect the intelligence of your audience. Then, and only then, a genuine asshole might you be.
I don’t say that the report is accurate or not accurate,” the Schulers’ lawyer, Dominic Barbara, told “Good Morning America’s” Chris Cuomo Aug. 7, referring to the toxicology report. “What I say is that none of this case is logical.”
No Jerkoff.. whats NOT logical you trying to say the weed and alcohol ended up in her system because of a medcical condition! That is NOT logical.. IN my opinion, it is completely LOGICAL to assume this dumb bitch was driving drunk and high since the toxicology tests came back that she was drunk and high.. huh,, maybe its just me, but i’ll believe the doctor over the lawyer.
brand new member, computer illiterate and virtually unteachable. can’t type either. please be gentle, this is my first time.
i’m confused; early on in the post it is stated, “The Associated Press reported today that investigators could not find any evidence that Schuler, drank alcohol or smoked marijuana before getting in the car…” then, a little later, i read, ” The toxicology report would later reveal that Schuler had the equivalent of 10 drinks and marijuana in her system. A bottle of vodka was found at the crash scene.” ummm, which is it? i’m sure i’m missing something. or i might just be confused after voting so many people to hell.
This is a simple reading comprehension problem.
ccccccccccccccc|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|ffffffffffffffffffff
Imagine the above represents a timeline. The letter “c” represents the time before Diane gets in the car. The pipe “|” represents the moment she gets in the car. The “x’s” represent the time she drives, the next “|” is the moment of the crash and the f is the time after the crash.
She did not drink during c or f, she drank during time x the equivalent of 10 drinks and smoked a joint of marijuana.
Before a time, indicates a prior event or period. During is an action that takes place as part of the event. After is a consideration following a particular series of events or event.
Before, none, during 10 drinks and a joint, after, she was dead.
well, that makes sense. thank you.
you’re welcome carolinablue
Oh man. Funny you should post this today, it makes me think of when I was at work this afternoon. A man came up to me and asked me a question about something he was looking for and while I was telling him where to find it I noticed he reeked of booze. I was about 3 feet away from him and just about could get a buzz from his breath! He went away for a bit to shop, then came back up to my register to pay for his things. (Note: I do *NOT* work in a liquor store!)
I watched him leave and sure enough, he was driving! :-(
I might have reported that one to the authorities….he could be the next Diane Schuler!
I’m just curious. What happened with all of Daniel Schuler and Dominic Barbara’s posturing about obtaining DNA from her toothbrush and exhuming Diane Schuler’s body to “prove” that the autopsy and toxicology reports were wrong? There hasn’t been any more news on that.
It appears the Schulers finally chose a laboratory in Maryland to do the testing. Now they’ll have tests done on the samples the Westchester County Medical Examiner has stored, to:
a. Prove they came from Diane Schuler
b. retest the samples to verify the ME’s results
They are, of course, hoping to impeach the Medical Examiner’s numbers. If they don’t get what their looking for with this set of tests, they plan on exhuming Diane’s body and doing a second autopsy.
I guess if that doesn’t work, the Schulers are going to hire a wizard and change the laws of chemistry and physics.
They can’t change the laws of physics and chemistry, Max. I know. I tried. I can’t tell you what happened because the concussion left me with a bit of selective amnesia, but I can tell you dogs and cars were howling, I was stained entirely puce, all my hair was burned off and the smell lasted for months. I terrified children and the elderly for weeks after, which really was the only positive effect. The rest was completely meh.
From what I understand the dynamics of an autopsy, it isn’t like it is on TV, of course… And they would’ve been doing DNA results and such preemptively.
The difficult part of them attempting to bring in a toothbrush or other personal item that would have DNA in it is in the long run, it could’ve been tampered with.
How can the toxicology and autopsy findings both be wrong? Plus all of the erratic driving for that long? I didn’t think that strokes lasted that long. And who ever would think, my blood sugar is dropping, instead of eating a few pieces of candy, I’m going to drink a bottle of vodka? Puh-leaze. That bitch was the only one who deserved to die…those poor children and the poor innocent people who died along with them. I think the denials of the results are a case of extreme guilt on the part of her husband for letting his drunk and still drinking wife drive his children and nieces….
and BTW, to The Snake….trolls try to be a little bit more sneaky about their trollism. You are so obvious, you won’t even rile anyone up like that. You should brush up in troll class before trying again…
Thank you for the update on this tragedy. I think about the families affected by this almost every day. The pictures of the kids haunt me. I feel most badly for Warren and Jackie Hance. I can’t imagine how they sleep at night in what is probably a nice home built for a large family yet the family they created together is gone. Poor Warren, he has to live with the loss of his children and his sister, with limited explanation as to why. God Bless him.
Are the Gagnon’s and the Schuler’s related? I see lots of similar behavior downplaying the fault of the accused.
This is tragic. However, it just doesn’t make sense to me that a mother whom, by all accounts, was loving and attentive. Since most people who knew her (family and others) say that she did not have a drinking problem (that they knew of), she was at least a functional alcoholic. I’m sorry but I know a fair deal about drug and alcohol addiction and no attentive mother, alcoholic or not, gets into a car sober and slams 10 shots with her children and nieces in the car. Something happened to this woman. I don’t deny that she drank or smoked but something snapped mentally to make her do that. It was not a decision like a normal “drunk driver” makes. This was something different. I wish everyone would stop slamming her family. What do you want them to say? It was by all accounts unusual behavior for her AND she was definitely sober when they got in the car. What do you people really want from her family? They are suffering just as much, if not worse, than anyone else involved in this case. I wish they could really piece everything in this case together because it just makes no sense that a sober woman of normal mental capacity would be driving her children and nieces and would start slamming shots of vodka and smoking a joint. Doesn’t make sense and if it doesn’t make sense, something is usually missing.
This sentence doesn’t follow logic.
Diane Schuler did, others have done the same. Either she is not an attentive mother and only “acted” like one to get by, or your proof is wrong.
Not all accounts, only those of her family. They have motives to protect Diane’s memory. Denial is a large stage of grief.
Incorrect, they are suffering less than the Bastardis, because they are inflicting pain on the victims of this crime, by protecting the murderess. You’re only seeing the perspective of Diane’s family, is this because you know them or are a member of their family? I ask, because we’ve seen this behavior before. This is a process. You have to be able to empathize with the whole situation before you can understand it. One group deserves more sympathy than others. While there’s still some for the Schuler’s, there’s a limitation in how much their grief can impact others or the severity of the crime. They don’t get to white wash this. Just because they didn’t notice how good Diane was at hiding her addictions, doesn’t mean they get to continue her deceptions.
What makes more sense?
She’s a rare medical condition that’s never been heard of before, or she’s a secret drunk who so fooled her family that she’s been hiding her drinking problem for years, and orchestrated a way she could drink where no adults were watching her?
It was and it is. Why do you think this way? Reveal your motivations.
bo, you NEVER know what an alcoholic will do. nobody does, not even the alcoholic him or herself. good intentions, love of family, nothing matters when the craving hits. women alcoholics are the most likely to be secret drinkers and can fool even the people living with them. a binge drinker is likely able to maintain for some time, drinking only when alone, disposing of the evidence, sobering up before family comes home, the list goes on. some even leave “to visit family/friends/go on a business trip, etc.. an alcoholic is in the grip of a physical addiction characterized by a mental obsession and is capable of the most twisted logic and justification you can imagine.
I’ve been reading this site for some time. Nothing on here has ever disturbed me the way that this craigslist posting has. Its unimaginable that a person can single-handedly inflict this type of death and destruction, and upon her own family no less. If only there was a way to bring someone back from the dead so that we could kill her again.
“Humanity at its best” usually occurs directly after “humanity at its worst”.
To Jason:
I don’t have any “motivations”. I’m not related to this case and do not know any of the parties involved but I have been following this story closely. The first point you make about me saying no attentive mother does that, I still stand by that. I know people drink and get in the car and drive their kids around but I find it hard to believe that she would leave SOBER on a road trip and just decide it’s time for some booze- I think SOMETHING happened to her. Whether it was a mental breakdown or maybe she was having some sort of extreme bodily pain and the only thing she could think of to do to numb it was drink. (I’m not saying that is a right or rational decision). I just think something else happened. I don’t see someone sober getting THAT intoxicated with children in the car unless something happened (I am not trying to make excuses for this woman, but I am trying to understand what happened to her). When I said it was by all accounts unusal behavior for her you responed saying it was only by her families accounts–not so. Her neighbors, fellow parents at schools, people her kids played with and more have come forward and said they has no knowledge of substance abuse AND that she seemed like a good, attentive, loving mother. So, maybe she hid her addiction, but she was precieved as a good mom by MORE than just her family. There are also other witnesses from the campground and the gas station where she stopped that have atested to her sobriety (or seeming sober state of mind) before and shortly after she left (so it wasn’t just her family).
Also, you think the Bastardi’s are suffering MORE than the Schulers? Come on. The Bastardi’s have suffered a terrible loss and were innocent victims in this horrible accident, but they don’t have to live with the fact that their wife (the woman you are supposed to love more than anything) killed their babies. That is a totally different kind of pain that Mr. Schuler has to deal with. It’s like he’s losing his wife twice. AND to deal with the fact that she killed his daughter–that’s some heavy emotional burden to deal with. And MAYBE MAYBE MAYBE this woman wasn’t an alcoholic, maybe she fucked up hardcore one time. That doesn’t make it any better but the media wants to force something out of this family that MIGHT NOT BE TRUE. I don’t know. I think something happened to her, this woman was not Michael Gagnon.
I don’t agree with some of the things you’re saying Bo. The Schuler Family’s behavior, especially Daniel’s and his sister-in-law’s, has been insensitive and cruel at best. But whether or not she’s a full blown Alcoholic is really a pointless argument. The only facts that matter are almost indisputable – Diane was Drunk and high when she crashed head-on into the Bastardi’s SUV. Besides, if they do the hair follicle tests well have our answer as to how regularly Diane got high, and that will be a good indicator of her substance abuse habits in general.
To Bo:
You said:
I say, there are numerous examples of women/mothers/secret drunks who have done exactly that. Their friends and families said the same thing her friends and family said. Just because Diane was a good actor and a liar, doesn’t need to produce or cast any doubt. Just because you can’t accept that Diane was a falling down drunk who endangered children because she wanted to drink without adults around to tell on her, doesn’t provide any evidence. It’s your opinion, your gut telling you that you’re right and the facts are somehow wrong. I don’t have your gut. I have the facts that were there. She had a bottle of vodka, 6 grams still undigested, marijuana in her system and several angry drunk phone calls with her brother, and she even threw the phone away so the children couldn’t tell on her any more. She got out of the car and threw the phone away. Something happened, that’s true, but it was the “clever facade” of a drunk who couldn’t pretend as well as she normally would have. That’s a reasonable conclusion from the facts at hand. An unreasonable conclusion looks for a Dr. House style medical drama, an assassin who pours the alcohol down her throat, pays to have a body exhumed to argue with the toxicologist, or is convinced that an “attentive mother” when sober, can’t be an inattentive mother when she’s falling down drunk.
And I think there’s fundamentally no real difference except that Gagnon survived and this woman purposefully endangered her own flesh and blood. She thought it was okay to drink and drive. She orchestrated this endeavor to get her and the kids away from adults, and she had the forethought to bring marijuana and alcohol with her for the trip. Think about that last part and consider the premeditation. Even these folks who saw her “appear to be sober,” while she was “appearing to be sober” she was in fact in possession of a joint and some alcohol she was intending on drinking in her car.
To the Bastardis suffering more, I strictly say yes, they are suffering more. They have to grip with this problem in reality and deal with cold hard facts, and they have to deal with the irrationality of their victimizer’s family who claim their suffering was something it most obviously was not. Both sides lost family, and if you can quantify the numbers and value of life, sure, we’ve got children versus adults, but we also have morons in front of cameras saying some magical stroke can hit people and make them instant drunks and this is all an act of God. The Bastardis’s, like most victims of drunk driving don’t want the word Accident used. An accident isn’t this purposeful; this hurtful. This was a planned period of selfishness. This was a planned period that turned into an accidental murder, but not an accident. It was premeditated flagrant disregard for the law and others safety. It was ignorance and a blatant attempt to ignore the consequences of her actions. There was a chance to stop her, there was a plea from her relatives to stop, but she bull headed past and ran away from the people who could save those children. While she is not Michael Gagnon, the parallels are so astounding, the legal case would have been so similar if she’d have lived.
Holy shit Jason, I think I just became your biggest fan. What an excellent retort!
Maybe it is just becuase I grew up in a bum-fuck town in the middle of nowhere but there are unfortunately a LOT of closet drunks/druggies! The wife of my water ski coach died of sclerosis of the liver and had no mind function from alcoholism at her lifes end. No one would have guessed it. She drove us everywhere in a car or a boat. There are 4 other examples at the tip of my tongue but saddly it does happen.
What I don’t understand is how you keep it from your family? My husband knows if I had coffee earlier in the day.
I cant understand why the reamainder of her family is so steadfastly denying her toxicology report. Maybe they just can’t bring themselves to terms with the fact that the rest of their family members are dead over something they could have put a stop to and the truth is something they just can’t bear to live with.
To Jason:
I think we just have to agree to disagree.
To Max The Cat-
I’m interested to see what the hair follicle analysis shows, as that will shed insight on to how often she used. As for her husband and other relatives saying “hurtful” things to the Bastardi’s–their family member is being trashed all over the media. And you know what—noone REALLY knows what happened. We know she had alcohol and pot in her system but we don’t know much else. What if she did have some sort of mental breakdown or seizure or hell–I don’t know, anything that caused her extreme pain to the point of making irrational decisions. We wouldn’t publicly roast someone if they were epileptic and slammed into a car full of kids. I’m not saying its the same thing, but alcoholism is a disease and if society is going to treat it like one socially, we should treat it like one legally.
We take away licenses if you suffer from Grand Mal Seizures.
Driving is a privilege that id someone is diagnosed with alcoholism should preclude them from driving. Ask your local MADD representative how many times they’ve heard and defended against this lame call to equate epilepsy with a disease caused by personal choice and genetic predisposition.
Alcoholism is treated as a disease not unlike Lung Cancer caused by smoking, Diabetes caused by obesity, and hyper-tension caused by poor diet.
Yes, addiction is a disease. No one knows that better than I do. Being a recovering drug addict with a few years of sobriety I can tell you one of the symptoms of my disease is our inability to accept personal responsibility for our actions. I liked to blame my parents and my ex-wife for my addiction, and when I smacked the ex around, it was because she just wouldn’t leave me alone. The day I put her in the hospital, well hell, she started the argument. You see what I’m getting at? And the thing is, as stupid as my excuses sound now, My mom and dad will swear to this day that I never did anything all that bad.
Diane’s family isn’t helping her, they’re just continuing what they’ve always done – enabling her to be a functional alcoholic. Only this time it bit everyone on their collective asses – plus 7 innocent people had to pay with their lives. You say that the way they’re treating the Bastardis, the Hances, and the Longos is justified, because people are bashing Diane. I say to you that the families of the victims are victims themselves, but Diane made a choice to drink that day. Her alcoholic mind figured out a way to give her permission to get drunk with 4 children in her van, and that’s just what she did. She knew it was wrong, but she did it anyway, because satisfying the cravings was more important that the lives of those kids – what the hell, she’d gotten away with things like that before.
That’s how alcoholics think – that’s how we operate. To think that we have no control over our actions is a TV movie fantasy. Ask any Alky or addict whose got some time clean and they’ll tell you the same thing. I feel for Diane because I know “there but for the Grace of God go I,” but I don’t for one minute think she’s not 100% responsible for everything that happened on July 26th. I’m disgusted with the Schulers for their lack of empathy for Diane’s victims and their families, and their incredible selfishness in the face of overwhelming evidence of Diane’s wrongdoing. I just hope the results of the second set of tests aren’t vague in any way or we’ll never hear the end of this. However they come out, they better be conclusive.
Thank you, Max, for having the strength to clean yourself up and stay clean. You’re a wonderful person who could have destroyed himself completely and that would have deprived the rest of us of too much good Max stuff!
Diane was a wonderful person too, by most accounts. I believe that. People are never all good or all bad. If only she’d been able to open her eyes to her problems before this happened. If only, her family wouldn’t be going through all of this on her behalf. They’re in extreme pain, they’re in denial and they’re lashing out. They’re terrified that such psychosis is in their blood. It’s something they will have to someday get used to, and move on.
I read this site and I imagine myself in the shoes of all participants, from the accused to the judge to their respective families and the jury. I cannot imagine, no matter how hard I try, finding out my brother, my father, my husband killed someone this way, or any other way, and that they’re going to trial and might be imprisoned or put to death. How in the world do you deal with that as a family member, good friend or co-worker? I mean, think about it – HOLY FUCK! After that sinks in and you’re possibly back to thinking mostly rationally, how do you deal with moving on? Again – HOLY FUCK! There should be survivor support not only for the family of the victims, but also the family of the perp if they want it. Too many broken people are walking around with open wounds in this society. It’s wrong.
But they have to realize that she chose to take that first sip and that first toke. She had a car full of children – she knew the risks and she chose to ignore them. We will never know why, and unfortunately ‘why’ is a question that needs to be answered before her family will truly be able to move on.
Even if Diana Schuler had a mental breakdown or severe pain and turned to alcohol during her drive with a car load of children, that doesn’t make it out. There is always the option to PULL OVER to the side of the road, which I believe she already did twice during her drive. She should have stayed pulled over if she was experiencing so many problems. There is no excuse for consuming alcohol while driving, especially not while driving a full load of children, and ESPECIALLY not while driving irradically going the wrong way on a highway. Alcoholism IS a disease, yes, but one that is regulated by the individual, not by some uncontrollable force within their body. She was sober when she entered the car, she should have exited the car sober, too. If she was so addicted to alcohol that she couldn’t last the whole drive without some, then she should have indicated that she was not feeling up to driving and allowed someone else to do it.
And for the record, I’m sure people would have no problem blaming an epileptic that caused a crash due to a seizure if it was clear that the individual was aware that their disease was so severe that it makes operating a vehicle a VERY dangerous task. Someone who has an unexpected and out of the ordinary seizure while driving is less at fault than one who has a pattern of seizures but choses to take the risk and drive anyways.
Comment Deleted By Editor
Let’s get creative with the filtering on this one Max.
Yeah, you’re right. I’m going to remove all traces of him from today and ban him.
What is it with these people popping up out of the woodwork lately? I guess assclowns run in packs. Being clowns, at least they have very tiny cars.
Yeah, like that sock puppeting nym stealer over at Michael Gagnon. That dude wants to be me so bad he’s stolen my name twice and used three different IP’s to get around his ban – I guess I’m gonna have to sic my guy on him like we did with Stapler-boy. These amateurs have no idea who they’re fucking with.
Good post, but for future reference, the correct word is ?effect,” not “affect,” as in “the EFFECT that it’s had on….”
Affect, as a noun, is usually rendered as “affectation” and refers to a frivolous or curious characteristic or trait. You can’t have an affect on someone, only an effect.
Love the site. Keep it coming.
Ah, shaddup, ya grammar Nazi!
LOL, just kidding Raymond, thanks for the correction. I try to catch all my mistakes, but I still miss a couple now and then. It’s very hard to proofread one’s own work, let me tell you. I’m actually amazed I don’t make more errors than I do. Feel free to point out any other grammatical problems or spelling errors to me, either by commenting oy by email at editor@pysih.com
Glad you like the site – a lot of people put alot of work into this place to make it what it is, so compliments are always appreciated.
I’m not a drinker, so please understand that I have never had a chance to answer this question for myself. How long does it take after a drink for a person to get drunk? Or better yet, how long would it take for a woman like Schuler to drink and then start feeling the effects?
Alcohol, like many drugs, requires that you consume more to ‘feel’ it as you build up your tolerance. If she was drinking beer, it might take a real alcoholic a few – 3 or 4 – before they feel it. She was drinking hard alcohol, Vodka if I recall correctly. That’s a different ballgame, especially if she was swigging it straight from a bottle. It wouldn’t take much in that case, as the average human mouth can hold several shots at once. And the effects would be pretty quick, maybe a few minutes, before she’d feel them. Add a joint to that and you really can’t gauge it. It depends on the person.
Thank you.
http://www.myfoxny.com/dpp/news/local_news/new_york_state/091008_Taconic_Crash_Investigation
new info on phone calls… watch video.
i read your pages quite often … this piece that the CL reader wrote on … it was raw and real and endearing and sad and warming (warming for the individuals that tried to help) tears in my eyes still now …
Thank you meg, it touched me too. The writer managed to convey the heartbreak of the scene but still leave the reader with a sense of inspiration. I wish I could get this person to write for us.
Wow, that Craigslist posting got to me- having been a cop for 9 years, I know what those memories can do, they never truly go away. Many years ago as a brand-new rookie, I was at the scene of an accident where a teenage girl had been thrown from the back of a motorcycle and hit the curb head-first without a helmet. To this day, all those years later, I can still vividly remember that she was wearing a grey sweater with a yellow sunflower embroidered on it, light blue jeans and brown and white saddle shoes. She died as I knelt next to her giving first aid, I was trying to keep her hanging on until the ambulance got there but it was just too late. I can still hear the little whimpers she made as she lay in the gutter. The kid driving the bike was drunk, stoned, had no license and was speeding on a rain-slick street, took a corner too fast and laid it down and she went flying off the back. He broke both his hips and was screaming at me, calling me a “fucking pig” because I wouldn’t leave the girl to come help him. I guess the point of all this is that drunk driving is so senseless and hurts so many people, the person who posted this will unfortunately carry these memories forever. My sympathy and prayers to him and to the family of those poor little girls. This is just so freaking sad and senseless.
I can’t imagine how first responders deal with all the trauma they encounter. The first responders, the good samaritans who show up to help, all of these people are forgotten victims. I feel also for the people who were there on the scene and were trying to help the victims of Diane’s selfishness who will never forget what they saw that day.
I think what bothers me the most is that the father will NOT accept the science behind the situation. There is no medical condition that could ‘create’ remnants of marijuana and alcohol consumption in someone’s system like that. 10 drinks? Are you kidding me? Even if the man or family member I loved more than life had hidden away a problem like this, I’d believe something like that. I know it’s denial. I know it must hurt… But being so stubborn doesn’t help anybody. It just frustrates me, as someone going to graduate school for pathology, that someone could not accept something so strong and conclusive.
I wonder if the strident family denial is an effort to keep themselves from feeling guilt for their role in enabling and covering for her addictions. Alcoholics are great at covering up but there are signs and no one wants to confront an angry alcholic so denial is so much easier. I don’t know how they can ignore the evidence and continue to argue this was some sort of oddball medical condition.
On the topic of closet alcoholics, my grandfather happened to be one-and my mother and my grandmother had no idea he was drinking-until after his death. When cleaning out his workshop, they found a combination of vodka bottles-the majority empty and some still half-filled hidden every where. They found enough bottles to fill a normal kitchen size trash can. He had them hidden in storage containers, tool boxes-any place you could hide a bottle.
My mother is a very observant person, and she had no idea her father was a closet drinker. I am not trying to defend Diane Schuler or her husband, but I just wanted to put my two cents in.
Knowing about it and denying to the world that there is a problem is soooo much different from simply not knowing about it. This family knew, or they wouldn’t be grasping at stupidity to defend her.
Observant people aren’t as observant sometimes when they’re really close to the person. That’s as tough as trying to identify and address your own personal problems. Being so close to the problem colors your ability to be objective. It’s like stinking, but not smelling your own foul. Heck, maybe this is the kind of family that likes the smell of their own farts. Some people are like that.
Being here in Germany it’s hard to sometimes get information. I first heard about his on German news. I though that the woman had to be crazy. Naturally the reporter was taking the woman’s side. So many children in the vehicle they were most likely screaming and crying, bla bla bla.
It just didn’t jell. so I started looking. thats when I found rounurs of her maybe being drunk. so I was patient and waited for the blood tests to come back. She was drunk and out of controll. So I wrote a mail to the reporter and the news program with all the links and they reported only on what the father had to say.
the woman was drunk and that has been proven. Trying to spin that fact in to something else is dishonest and disgusting. Those poor children are dead becasue a selfish woman couldn’t comtroll her greed.
I love to smoke when I drive. I really do. Health rants will be completly ignored by me so please save it.
B U T I never smke when my daughter is in the car. Never.
I know this woman is in hell and those children are in heaven. there is that.
Just reading the news stories about this had a profound effect on me; I can’t even begin to imagine what it must be like for the people who actually saw it happen.
It’s all so senseless and tragic. There is nothing more horrific than children dying due to the actions of the adult who was supposed to be protecting them.
Now imagine for a moment, that you were the Bastardi’s, and you have to deal with the nitwit husband and his supporters, spouting off that Diane wasn’t on alcohol or marijuana, and she “never” used these products. They’re trying to get some closure by getting the DA’s office to investigate the husband’s involvement, but the DA is patently refusing, claiming the charges died with Diane.
You can spend your whole life as sober as a church mouse, and a drunk driver can wipe out a huge percentage of your family, and there was nothing you did wrong. There’s drunks who get off with 12 months in jail for killing someone, who go right back into the bottle and behind the wheel when they get out.
It really is quite sad that one person’s decision to drink and drive can cost so many people their lives. I’m not normally a hard-ass when it comes to jail terms, but drunk driving is one of the few crimes that I’d like to see punished with longer prison sentences, especially if they do it with children in the car.
People often argue that drinking affects you judgment to the point where you don’t realize that you’re too drunk to drive, but that’s complete bullshit as far as I’m concerned. Unless you’re half passed out (therefore unable to even get into the car, let alone start it and attempt to drive it), you still have enough control to stop yourself from driving.
So heartbreaking.
Her husband is an idiot!!!!!
No, her husband is an enabler and co-dependent, which makes him blind to her flaws. He is in need of Alanon but will never get help because he doesn’t think there is a problem.
wonder if they were able to question the surviving child? I was thinking over the Thanksgiving and Christmas holidays how utterly sad and unbearable it must have been for all the families, including Schulers’.
It makes me so angry when stupid gawkers park in the road and run onto the scene of an accident, blocking the way for emergency personnel. If you don’t have a medical background, get the hell out of the way!!!
I have been wittness to a few accidents in my life. One I remember well was in Dallas Tx. I was in the Army at the time and justt he week before I went through a refressher course for Combat Life Saver. I was the first there and I checked both drivers to make sure they were alive, awake and were talking. Both were but one had a very large gash on his head that was really spirting blood. Not a very good thing to have happen. When the EMT’s got there I had the guy out of the car and his head dressed as best I could wit what I had on me. The EMT’s told me I did a damn good job. And later I got aletter from them thanking me for what I did. What I did I learned in the Boy Scouts. Nothing major.
According to you I should have just sat there or drove on? That man would most likely have died from blood loss or at the least have gone in to shock had I not done a damn thing. But thats OK just so you can make your appointment right?
Should I be in an accident I pray people will respond even if it’s to hold my hand and tell me I’ll be OK. It would give me focus and a better feeling.
The point I am making is don’t block the way for the people who have the tools to save the victims. If you can actually help them, good for you.
By the way, I recently saw an accident where a car rolled over down an embankment along a very sharp curve. People in cars/trucks/SUV’s had stopped, and their vehicles lined the entire curve, some of them were even partially blocking the busy 2 lane highway. The way they were stopped nearly caused an accident with the cars that were coming from around the curve and couldn’t see them jutting out into the highway. One had to wonder how the emergency personnel was going to get down that embankment with all of the vehicles blocking the way. Additionally, many of the people who had stopped were simply standing around and gawking. Seconds count in these situations. If you can’t be of help, why stop and further complicate the situation?
Look at this article, it’s sickening: http://www.tampabay.com/features/humaninterest/article1023635.ece