Diane Schuler: An Interesting Perspective
When I first wrote up the Diane Schuler tragedy back in July of 2009, the facts were still coming in. I tried to keep every up to the minute with frequent updates, but it was impossible to catch every development when it happened.
Fortunately for this website, one of our regulars, FuzzyWuzzy, became admittedly obsessed with finding the truth behind all the bullshit that came out of the Schuler and Hance family camps concerning the head-on collision that claimed the lives of Diane and 7 innocent victims. He posted several comments stating his findings, and they were good – very, very good.
Because the Schuler and Hance families have worked so hard to confuse the issue as to what really happened the day in July, Fuzzy debunked just about every lie they told, and also came up with some very interesting theories about Diane’s thinking. He also didn’t have many nice things to say about Diane’s husband Daniel. I can safely say that I probably read 95% of the articles and official documents released on this case, and Fuzzy’s article here is hands down the most complete, thorough, and well written piece I’ve seen on the Diane Schuler tragedy.
But perhaps he may have gotten a little too close to the truth, because Fuzzy posted the same comments he posted on PYSIH on several other websites. He informed me the other day that those comments were being suddenly and systematically removed from most of the websites other than PYSIH. I found that a bit curious.
So, to more prominently display his work on our website, and to make sure people who want to read what he found out will be able to do so, I asked FuzzyWuzzy to consolidate all his comments into one article that I could publish on our front page. This is the result of all his hard work.
Please read this, you won’t be disappointed. Some of the author’s conclusions are pure conjecture – he states this clearly in a couple of places – but most of what he concludes is backed up with solid facts that can’t be made to disappear. Unlike those comments FuzzyWuzzy made on certain other websites, websites that don’t seem to hold the First Amendment in any kind of regard
-Max The Cat
The Diane Schuler tragedy on the Taconic in July 2009 has been out of the news for a while now. However, the innocent victims of her actions have recently filed a civil suit since the 
Westchester County DA declined to follow through on the case to examine the ‘strong fragrance of criminality’ noted by the victims lawyers. There is much to this story that has not been revealed, and the public has a right to know what kind of crazy people are driving our roads. There will never be closure for the victims, or for the many people who were affected by this story.
Since I drive the same route where this accident took place, I can’t get it out of my mind, seeing that spot week after week and trying to make sense of it. So much information was released by the media, the police reports, the surveillance video etc… that I could not help but look at it all in detail and try to make sense of it for myself.
Here is what I have come up with, much of it is based on the facts presented, much of it I have obviously inferred, but after many hours of consideration, I think my story is a reasonably plausible explanation for something so outrageous that it almost defies the 
human mind to comprehend.
The more I read about this case, the clearer it gets; it was a murder/suicide. The official story put out by her family is that ‘something medical had to have happened’. That the toxicology report saying she was drunk and high on pot is wrong. That she never drank. But the evidence is not there, and in fact has been disputed by family members who said she smoked pot regularly and her husband who publicly said she never drank, but told the police she drank the weekend of the crash.
I, and every other sane person, disagrees with the absurd theories put forth so far, Anbesol, stroke, toothache, bump on the leg…. etc. This is not the ‘mommy’s a secret addict’ story like the media has perpetuated to no end, she was uniquely crazy and suicidal and had to know what she was doing. Those people know what happened and have been protecting themselves since the brother first called the 
police and sugar-coated the situation as ‘a possible medical emergency’ and the husband only can say ’she was sober when she left..” so its not my fault. The husband hired shark lawyer Dominic Barbera and Tom Ruskin, convicted felon private investigator to defend Diane’s image to the public.
Private investigator Thomas Ruskin, 55, of CMP Protective & Security Group of Manhattan, was an NYPD detective until he was indicted in 1996 in Louisiana on a 12-count federal indictment, charging him with several felonies, including conspiring “to defraud various commercial airlines,” according to federal court documents.
After being put on modified duty, he retired from the NYPD in March 1999, a police spokesman said. Two months later, he pleaded guilty to a single federal count of conspiracy in 
Louisiana, a felony.
-Max
By way of background told by those involved, Diane Schuler, her husband Danny and their 2 small children went camping with Diane’s brother’s 3 children at their camper that was set up in a campsite in Sullivan County NY. The story goes that Danny went to the campsite on Thursday morning for a day or two of solitary fishing, just him and his dog. Diane worked Thursday and Friday, then packed up her kids, drove from eastern Long Island to Floral Park NY to pick up the other three kids and drive her brothers minivan to the camp site on Friday evening. None of the witness reports say anyone saw Diane at the campsite, but the owner said she saw them leave around 9:30 Sunday morning for the 140 or so mile trip back home.
They left a campsite in separate vehicles, with Diane taking all 5 kids under the age of 9 while Danny took the dog. Diane stopped at McDonald’s around 10 am, then stopped for gas 
around 10:45, then hit the highway to drop off her brothers kids and then pick up her car and continue home with her kids. The story did not pan out the way it was supposed to.
Here’s how it went.
At the first stop at McDonald’s, Diane was caught on video apparently (it has not been released) having a discussion with the cashier and then the manager trying to get Chicken Selects during breakfast since they do not serve them at that hour, eating and letting the kids play on the playground. She convinced them to make them. Maybe she argued with them at McDonald’s to get her kids their last favorite meal and let them play in the playground there since she was gearing up for the fatal ride. Was it premeditated? She fed the kids, got her OJ mixer to go. The McDonald’s employees told police she did not seem intoxicated.
Later, her defenders used the Chicken Selects defense and state the McDonald’s employees determined she was not drunk. Like no drunk person has ever successfully ordered at McDonald’s apparently. Of course; there is no chance the McDonald’s employee’s, especially a manager, will admit anything suggesting they allowed an intoxicated person to leave their premises with 5 children in a vehicle. So there is zero value in any statement made by these employees, they were not under oath, plus they were interviewed by a convicted felon (Tom Ruskin) and the statement is not consistent with the official police report which does not mention any manager interaction or special orders etc… They have every possible reason to 
lie to cover their liability.
Think about it, why has there been no crazy Dominic Barbera theory that she got sick after eating at McDonald’s? With all the crazy theories they have put out there you would think this would be on the top of the list. So is there some conspiracy between the McDonald’s employees and the Schuler’s. If they thought she was drunk at McDonald’s, and made a scene requiring a manager to intervene (which was not in the police report) and then they gave her what she wanted and got rid of her, that implicates them, if they say she was drunk, it also implicates Danny who said she was not drunk ½ hour prior. This is just not a reliable account as both parties stand to lose if they make any admission she was impaired.
The next video is of Diane at a gas station where she pulls in, pumps her gas, then walks into the store where she takes 8 steps in and back out, pausing for a second to ask the clerk something. This clerk declined being interviewed by police, but did speak to Tom Ruskin and apparently stated she was sober. But the video shows he did not even look up as she walked in, plus she is wearing sunglasses the whole time.
I watched the gas station video a couple of times, first, she walks in and out of the place in about 10 seconds, the guy doesn’t even look up as she enters and the exchange seen can’t be more than on second as she asks something as she walks out the door and gets in the van where she sits for a few minutes, possibly dumping vodka into the OJ from McDonald’s?
If anything the video shows her as a reckless driver. She drives like a maniac. She peels out from the pumps at a much higher rate of speed than other cars in the video, whips around 180 degrees past the other pumps on the wrong side, (if someone had been pulling up she would have hit them head on) then she flies out the entrance, staying to the left side of the entrance (IN) where oncoming cars 
would be coming in to the station, then you can see her zooming out into oncoming traffic lane on the wrong side of the exit to make her left turn across the lane of oncoming traffic! The only thing this video ‘proves’ is that drunk or sober, she is a terror on the road and a menace
It looks like she peeled out of that gas station with a death wish. She drove like a maniac until she was numb enough to not care. She must have told her brother and sister in law something in those phone calls that sealed her fate, she left the phone and with it all hope of being stopped or saved, she drove up the Saw Mill to the Taconic, turned around and came back to end it all. Was she not confused, but rather building up her nerve.
Many witness reports from the police detail her crazed ride down Route 17 and onto the New York State Thruway, where she tailgated, honked, flashed her brights, passed cars on the shoulder, stopped at least twice to be sick by the side of the road, drove on the grass at the Ramapo Rest Area.
The next stop was just over the Tappan Zee Bridge, where the crux of the ending of the story seems to have developed. One of her brother’s kids, Emma, called home scared, talking about the slurred speech of Diane. Several phone calls later with her brother and sister in law, something happened.
She got out of the car and left the phone by the side of the road to eliminate the distraction. The phone probably got dumped because the kids 
kept calling home. I think this is where her plan was crystallized. Something came out in those calls that she could not live with. She knew they were coming to look for her as her brother told her to stay there, he was coming to get her. As soon as the kids told the brother what the road signs said, she went in the opposite direction, north, up the Saw Mill so they would be looking in the wrong place. She was not confused, she was still making premeditated decisions to carry out the plan.
Then she told her brother she was on Southern State Parkway on Long Island, come on, no matter how drunk you are you can tell the difference between the 2 mile long Tappan Zee toll bridge soaring over the Hudson and Southern State pkwy. She had gone through the toll literally 30 seconds before making the call. She didn’t crash into the toll booth and was able to pull over to the pull off on the right shoulder. The 4 or 5 right hand toll lanes there are all cash only, since they claim they checked the time on her EZpass, that means she probably went through tolls on the left and had to navigate across at least 5 lanes of toll plaza traffic to the pull off without hitting anything.
The details of these phone calls are the key. But I am afraid the brother is not telling the whole story about the phone calls with Diane. Both of them talked to her, but I really think it was the kids that called 1st, then Warren called back and got her on the phone. The content of this call is the key to her mindset. I really doubt she said she wasn’t feeling well and had tunnel vision, etc…if she was slurring and calling her brother Warren by her husband Danny’s name, she was out of it and not going to be describing her symptoms like that. I think they are putting words in her mouth.
What was said that made her get out of the van and put the phone on the divider? What made her drive away in the opposite direction they would have thought she was going in to look for her?
She hung up on Warren, left the phone and took off in the opposite direction fully aware of what she was doing and she wouldn’t be distracted by his repeated calls her phone picked up as missed calls. So why didn’t he call the police right away?
Instead, he drove all the way to Westchester looking for her and then stopped at the police station. It was his wife Jackie who called the police from home after Warren left. In the police calls when they were looking for her, they never mention the vision, or confusion problems, he only describes it a possible medical emergency. The cops were probably looking for someone stopped by the side of the road when they should have put out an APB for a crazy confused driver menacing the population of the roads.
Tapes of phone calls to the police were released. Where they are attempting to track her cell phone. But it was too late, an hour had passed since the last phone contact with Diane, and by the time Warren arrived at the Police station, Danny was home already and everyone else was already dead. Another thing I noticed on the tapes of the brother at the police station is that when they are discussing the cell phone they mention that the voice mail says “Diane Hance” not Schuler even though the phone was registered under the name Diane Schuler and they were married for 6 or 7 years (according to the New York Magazine article, Danny didn’t even know how long they were married).
From this, a picture emerges that Danny went there on early Thursday, had a nice relaxing time by himself, while Diane had to work Thursday and Friday, then get her kids ready and packed up, drive to Floral Park, pick up the other kids, drive to the campground and take care of everyone. Even her brother and sister-in-law were having a weekend to themselves, but she was stuck with all 5 kids and a clueless husband.
They drank Friday night at the campground he says. Then Saturday Danny says they went to bed at 11:30 and he got up at 5. So, likely Danny crashes out, Diane has insomnia (as her family has stated she suffered from and smoked pot to fall asleep), so she stays up drinking and smoking all night. He gets up at 5 and goes fishing, leaving her to wake up the kids, pack up and get all the kids in the car to take them out for breakfast and then drive them home, drop off the kids in Floral Park then drive out to Suffolk while Danny and the dog went off in the pickup truck merrily oblivious. They supposedly leave together, but he doesn’t stop at the McDonald’s with her to help with the kids or anything, he keeps going, he doesn’t follow her, or take his son, or any of the kids. She then has to stop for gas too where she is probably looking for Tylenol since she is hung over. But her sister in law said she didn’t believe in medicine, so why was she looking for Tylenol?
In the police report, the brother then says this was the first season they camped at that campsite, so how does the owner say she knows them for years? And Danny says they have been going there for years. The brother is very vague with the times the kids called (‘sometime in the late morning”). Wouldn’t it have been tormenting enough so he would have looked at those call times over and over trying to figure it all out minute by minute? He and his wife had to know what was up, they both talked to a trashed Diane Schuler and had to know she was wasted. The kids were crying in the background. In the police report Danny says the brother called him and said there was an accident, but the police tapes have Warren talking to Danny before the crash trying to get information on the phone bill..etc. so they could track her.
On page 10 of the police report, a witness describes traveling north on the Taconic at 1:15 pm and being cut off by the minivan ALSO TRAVELING NORTH getting on the Taconic from the Saw Mill Parkway. This is right where the crash happened, about 200 yards north of the Saw Mill/Taconic merge. This means she went up the Taconic past the crash site, then turned around and got back on the same exit ramp in the wrong direction. She scouted the route! Probably saw a perfect spot to end it all and headed back down the road heading south knowing what was going to happen and where, there is a blind curve with a hill right at the crash site, no chance for the unwitting accessory to the crime to react evasively. There are two (2) turnarounds in that stretch of road, plus a lot of wide grass median and shoulder to change your mind if you wanted to.
Also, the husbands story about the vodka being his is total BS. He drinks beer, very few men drink vodka as their drink of choice, especially when they are beer drinkers. Vodka is a chick drink. And if it takes you 9 months to drink 1.75 liters of vodka, why are you carrying it around, why is it that important? The story about the vodka bottle is an example of the deep denial. That bottle costs 25 dollars, how frugal are they that they claim they carried the same bottle for a year? Sorry, but if you have a couple of drinks a week, that bottle is going to last 2 months tops. And who is going to go camping for the weekend and have one tiny little drink, then bring it home? So, that means they drink it at home too, so how could it last that long? Just doesn’t make sense. If the vodka meant that little to them why carry it around? They guy was sort of a cop, doesn’t he know it’s illegal to carry open containers? Oh, right, he said he didn’t pack it, so she did, without his knowledge.
A quote from the Steve Fishman article in New York Magazine (click here to view the entire article):
I want to know if Danny feels guilty in some general way, for inattention or absence or anything. “Absolutely not,” Danny says.
Wow. How can someone have no feelings of guilt at all? It is incomprehensible. Not even guilty for not following her down the road? For not calling her when she didn’t show up? He was home before they even crashed. I can’t possibly imagine not second-guessing every minute of that day and being overcome with guilt? Come on, guilt is one of the most basic human emotions there is, even when you have no control over a situation it is there. Is it possible this man has no emotions whatsoever? All he has lamented over is the loss of his wife and child, he never even mentions the 3 relatives, or 3 strangers that lost their lives.
The Fishman story told how Diane cut her mother out of her life completely since the age of 9, pretending she did not exist due to her choice to leave the family, even though the other siblings and her father did not shut her out and her mother has said she reached out to her for a relationship, stating it was Diane’s choice to keep her away. That is a huge thing to hold inside for 27 years. I do think this is the elemental key to the whole story.
The public photos released of her wedding are telling, how could she, or anyone there, not be thinking about her mother, who was not invited. How do you go through your wedding day holding that inside? Since it was her wedding day, everyone else had to suck it up and it was all about her and not mentioning the obvious absence of the mother, the rest of the family would have invited her to such an event. So she is controlling the social situation completely, holding everyone hostage to her demons. Then having children and depriving them of their grandmother, and vice-versa.
This pattern of controlling social situations and punishing people who love you most due to perceived transgressions only makes me believe the murder/suicide theory more. Did she punish her husband and brother for something we will never know about? I am on the side of the victims who feel there is much more to the story. On the one hand they say she is frugal, that’s why they carried the same bottle of vodka around for almost a year.
The NY Magazine article says she was compulsive shopper however, buying a $300 purse for her sister in law on the spur of the moment, going out for milk and coming back with a Jeep, or grocery shopping and coming home with a plasma TV. This sounds like someone with an impulse problem to me, not a frugal one. There is much more in that story and I recommend it for background as it is the only source of information on the dynamics of these peoples lives.
So what caused the rage that led to this act? There was a 17-second call dialed from Diane’s phone to a guy in Oyster Bay, only 10 minutes from where she works, that morning. I won’t put his name here, but it is in the press where he was interviewed after the police talked to him. All he said to the press was that it was “weird”. Interestingly his last name is one letter off from her brother’s last name. How coincidental that a random wrong number would go so close to home. Since it was one of the kids making the calls, maybe they accidentally dialed a contact or recent call? I mean who actually dials numbers on their cell phone, especially when you have called that person at least 3 times in the past 2 hours. You just go to the contact or the recent calls. So that number had to be in the phone.
The precipitating event is still a mystery, but there are many clues. Something came out in those phone calls that sealed everyones fate. Did the kids overhear something she couldn’t let them reveal? Did she decide to punish her husband and brother for something, like finding out some secret? For challenging her for her behavior? For giving her an ultimatum?
In conclusion, since there are really no plausible medical conditions that make you randomly drive on the wrong side of the road, disputing the intoxication option leaves only premeditated murder suicide. So which is it? They can’t have it both ways. The truth must be revealed or we all must live with the fear that this could happen to any one of us for no reason? The victims deserve the truth and the secrets Diane kept can’t be kept or we are all enabling her, even in death.
The Photographs Are, From Top to Bottom:
01. Diane Schuler
02. Accident Scene
03. Accident Scene
04. The Hance Family – The children are, from left to right, Alyson Hance, 7, Katie Hance, 5, and Emma Hance, 9. All three girls died in the crash.
05. Guy Bastardi, 49. Victim.
06. Tom Ruskin, private eye and convicted felon.
07. Michael Bastardi, 81. Victim
08. Daniel Longo, 74. Victim.
09. Map of the crash scene
10. The Schuler Family. The children are Bryan, 5 at the time of the crash, who survived, and Erin, 2, who did not.
11. An unidentified 11-year-old girl at the funeral of the three Hance sisters. This picture broke my heart.
96 Comments »
I think this version of events is a lot closer to the truth than any other.
I think this is a well written and informative essay. Thank you for putting this together. I have been following this story for some time and hope all of the people involved peace in their lives. Peace will begin with truth.
I’ve been staring at this story for a while now, and I think your theory makes a lot of sense. This is such a sad story, and I was left with a lot of questions when I read the original posting of it. Clearly the blood tests showed that there were drugs and alcohol involved, but I was not convinced that there wasn’t more to the case due to the family’s attempts to cover up the truth or make excuses for her. It just wasn’t adding up. I haven’t had a drink in a long time since it lost its touch for me, but I am certain that even at my drunkest of moments I wouldn’t have driven my child anywhere. Sure, maybe a medical condition could make a person confused, but I think that alcohol and pot in the system ruled that one out. You can rule out hypoglycemia since she had just eaten at McDonald’s. You can rule out a fatal stroke or heart attack, etc since she was seen fully awake and staring at the road. In fact, you can rule out the majority of illnesses since they typically don’t occur in such a way that you lose the common sense to pull over and wait for help. Usually when I see people of her age completely alert but crazed in a way that might make sense to the tragedy, they are actually going through alcohol withdrawal, and since she was drinking…well…enough said. I did find the information that she “didn’t believe in medicine” to be interesting. Perhaps she was suffering from a mental illness that she refused medication for, and decided to self medicate via Vodka and pot therapy. I’ve seen the affects that the manic state of Bipolar can lead to, and people often medicate themselves by overindulging in downers, such as alcohol, prescription drugs, street drugs, etc. If she was in a manic phase it is hard telling what she could have been doing, and suicide is certainly not off of the list of possibilities. Ramble ramble ramble on I go. I am left with a couple of questions still. 1. What in the FUCK is her brother and sister-in-law thinking? If they are hiding information, I am truly sickened. I’m sorry, but family or not, if anyone killed every one of my children, I would be the first to out them if I knew something! I’d be on the news saying, yeah, we got into a fight, but that stupid bitch had no right taking my kids from me. I would trash her to the world, but maybe that’s just me. 2. One question to the author of this. I don’t know the location at all, but is it possible that she may have turned her van around to go back and retrieve her cell phone? I know it is a long shot, but just curious. Your theory is great, but I hate to think that she was so evil that she purposely took all those kids to the grave with her. Judging by the facts of the story and your input, sadly, she most likely did just that. Ugh! –end lengthy monologue.
P.S. If a family member of mine killed three innocent people and I had some information, I would be respectful enough to answer all of their family’s questions to the best of my ability, and would sympathize with them, at least giving them a public apology for the despicable behavior of my family member. Seriously, who would leave unanswered questions for these people. Quit defending this woman!
As against mixing as I am, I’ve been drunk off my as and stoned out of my mind simultaneously before. Even in the depths of it, I never would have gotten behind the wheel of a car. I knew I wasn’t in the right state of mind for it, and was in fact afraid of the idea. I even had someone else make my daiquiri because I didn’t want to blend my arm off. Pot = paranoia, especially if you’re drunk at the same time!
This woman wanted to die and be numb while she did it, and she wanted to hurt everyone around her in the process much more than she could have if she’d taken her own life alone. The repercussions of what she did will affect so many more people than just her family! Teachers, doctors, fellow students, the freakin mail man, her entire neighborhood, her work associates, people she knew at the market… She must have hated the whole world to do something like this.
I cannot believe I misspelled the word ‘ass’.
In my opinion, a person will only lose control of their actions if they’re drunk to the point of incapacitation (meaning they wouldn’t be able to unlock the car doors, let alone operate the vehicle) or high on hallucinogens/deliriums. Problem is, people will give themselves permission to do stupid things just because they’re drunk. They use it as an excuse for screwing up.
Plus, people should know better than to get so wasted that they can’t think straight. especially if they know how stupid they can get. If getting plastered leads them to think it’s okay to drive while drunk, don’t get plastered! Know your limit.
Fuzzy, thank you for this.
Fuzzy, What a great write up! I feel for you having to drive that route everyday, what a waste…why didn’t she just kill her self?
Fuzzy, they need you over at 60 Minutes.
While I’m not convinced that your conclusion is 100% correct, I must commend you on a great write-up of the events leading up to this terrible incident. Regardless of whether or not Schuler intentionally crashed, I think it’s been clear from the start that the picture being painted by the media and family members is entirely inaccurate, particularly the closet-alcoholic bits. The excuses made for her blood alcohol levels are beyond ridiculous; a percentage that high is always confirmed by second or even third tests in the lab, and even a false-positive from another medication would have registered a lower percentage, unless she was drinking gallons of toothache gel. In addition, false-positives for alcohol are usually the result of breathalyzers, as blood tests are significantly more accurate. Toothache gel affecting a breathalyzer I can believe, but a blood test? C’mon. I’m certain everyone here has already figured this out for themselves, though, given that it’s common sense.
In a lot of ways, I can understand why her husband would want to defend his wife from public scrutiny (though not to these extremes), but his actions seem to be more focused on defending himself. The same goes for other family members. I doubt there is any conspiracy between family members and the McDonalds employees; human selfishness tends to work on the individual level, with no need for group pacts in order to propagate a mutually beneficial lie. A better way of putting it would be a “silent conspiracy”, in which they all know they’re full of shit, but no one says anything out of fear of being held responsible.
You’re 100% correct about his statements regarding whether or not he feels guilty being very suspect. Hell, even I feel guilty when I read about this kind of thing in the papers, and I had nothing to do with the situation — why am I alive while other people’s lives are being cut short? In his desperation to rid himself of responsibility, the man is making it clear that he shares the blame. I just hope that he does feel some guilt, even if he won’t admit to it. I can’t stand the thought of this man not feeling SOMETHING in regard to his actions or lack thereof.
No matter what really happened, Diane Shuler will still be the primary cause of these terrible events. Her actions led directly to the deaths of numerous people, many children… and that is more than enough to convince me that this woman deserves some kind of divine retribution for her actions… if not eternal torment, then at least a finite punishment of some kind… anything to rebalance the scales.
Sorry, I forgot to expand on the original statement I made about not completely agreeing with your conclusion.
I don’t think there’s enough evidence to conclusively show that she was intentionally trying to crash. If we had access to those phone conversations, we might be able to draw conclusions, but as it stands we can’t make those kinds of assumptions.
That being said, I don’t completely disagree with you either. Your theory is feasible, even if it is just conjecture.
Regardless, I think we can all agree on one important and, in my opinion, undeniable fact: The ‘official’ story is complete bullshit.
Unfortunately, her previous behavior patterns of control, impulsivity, and selfishness would be consistent with her doing something like this, especially with drugs and alcohol on board. I knew someone with PPD who told me she was going to put her girls in her van and then drive it into a brick wall. (She got help that day). Seemingly “normal” people really are capable of things like this. I can’t bear the thought of how terrified those kids were in their last moments alive.
“her previous behavior patterns of control, impulsivity, and selfishness would be consistent with her doing something like this, especially with drugs and alcohol on board. ”
I completely agree.
Thinking about how scared the girls had to have been hurts my heart.
I appreciate all the support and comments. Thanks to Max for having the guts to publish this for me. I look forward to continuing the discussion.
It doesn’t take guts to publish the another person’s truth FuzzyWuzzy. It takes guts and dedication and a strong sense of right and wrong to TELL the truth, as you see it. That’s what you did here, and you should be proud of it. It’s not easy to let strangers know what you’re really thinking, because now you will be judged on these words you’ve committed to a computer screen. A lot of people now not only know your opinion about the Diane Schuler case, but also have some real insight into the kind of person you are and what kind of principles you live by.
I’ve read your article several times in the process of editing it for publication, and soon there was one thing I became very sure of – that some day I’d very much like to call you my friend.
I’m glad he preserved your perspective on the issue. It’s not surprising that a lot of blog owners have tried to censor you. Regardless of any differences in opinion, I think that your write-up does provide us with some very valuable insight into the causes of this tragedy.
Plus, I’m a very big fan of free speech, so I’m always happy when a website owner or contributor shares those ideals, regardless of the opinions being expressed.
Interesting perspective. I wonder if she was in a blind rage, hated her life, spouse, kids, and was filled with the same sort of spite that turns parents into people who kill their kids just to get back at the other spouse and in that blind rage “wanted to show them all” that she was going to get back at everyone who had pissed her off…who knows? In the end its always that innocent that pay. What a selfish, vindictive, spiteful, angry woman who deserves to go to hell
“If anything the video shows her as a reckless driver. She drives like a maniac. She peels out from the pumps at a much higher rate of speed than other cars in the video, whips around 180 degrees past the other pumps on the wrong side, (if someone had been pulling up she would have hit them head on) then she flies out the entrance, ” I watched it 10 times, mostly the end. She drives as if there is no right lane at all (that she is uintersecting) and she very nearly hits at least two cars she’s trying to pull out in front of. It looks *insane*.
This was an excellently written article. Thank you both for putting it together.
The mulish-ness of the brother and husband have pissed me off for quite awhile now. Have more respect for the victims you dunces! More respect than just shame for yourselves and hurt pride! Diane fucked up and so did you as a brother and husband!
I believe that you are right, Fuzzy. She drank a very large amount in a short period of time (more than she usually did) and if, also being an insomniac, she was in a more fragile mindset to begin with that day staying up, smoking, and being hung over. The family said something she didn’t at all like, and she set out for revenge. Selfish, awful choice.
RIP baby girls and the Bastardi family :(
Thanks, fuzzywuzzy, this was well written and interesting and it sure sounds plausible. Max, thanks for printing this! I love that this is the only website printing it. Diane Schuler sounds like a fat, spoiled, selfish, load, and her husband probably couldn’t stand to be around her. I say that, not to excuse his dumping all the work on her while he went merrily off with his best friend. But still. Watching her waddle in and out of the quickee mart, her driving afterwards, reading about her spending habits and her treatment of her mother — sounds like someone is just a little too used to getting her own way. “If i’m unhappy, then everyone is gonna be unhappy.” And innocent people suffered for it.
I dunno, there is too much conjecture in this story.
I think Diane may have had a death wish, but people who have death wishes don’t normally plan to take innocent victims with them – especially if the innocent victims are their own children and they are the mother/aunt of those children.
There’s a lot more to this story, and someday, someone will piece it all together and write a long article or a book, but at this time we still need more information regarding the phone calls and her prior drinking history.
Yes, she was a selfish evil bitch for taking out 7 other people, but there are still many unanswered questions.
Without the facts, what else is there?
interesting reading
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2174580/
Maternal filicide-suicide
A significant proportion (16-29%) of filicides end in completed suicide by the mother (56). Many other mothers make non-fatal suicide attempts in association with their filicides. When mothers of young children commit suicide, about 5% also kill at least one of their children (57,58).
Filicide-suicides have much in common with filicides committed by severely mentally ill mothers (15). Most frequently, these mothers have altruistic motives (15,23). Similar to results of other studies (15,20,48), our recent American study found that maternal filicide-suicide perpetrators killed older children more often than infants (mean age of children killed was 6 years old). The mothers often had evidence of depression or psychosis (23). These mothers often take the lives of all their young children.
” When mothers of young children commit suicide, about 5% also kill at least one of their children (57,58).”
That means 95% of them DON’T kill at least one of their children. As I said, it is very very rare that a mother who wanted to kill herself would also kill her own children and nieces along with her.
Anyone want to be that this story, or a “slightly-altered” version of it, winds up on a “Law and Order” episode? I’m betting it’s already written.
Actually, Law and Order already aired a Schuler-type episode a few months ago Ivy Mike. I didn’t see it, but I do remember there was some controversy when NBC first announced it would air.
If one of my family members did anything to hurt my other family members or anyone else like this I would be the first on here to apologize for being related to them and to give whatever information I could about what happened! I would submit the story here myself! This story hurts to read, so many lives have been shattered… I don’t care what happened, the truth needs to come out and blame needs to be placed. God bless the families who have to deal with this psycho’s decision, let her rot in HELL! Great write up. I pray that someday this site won’t need to exist, but sadly it does. Keep up the good work.
The whole thing is just sad. If you really have to kill yourself… REALLY JUST HAVE TO DO IT, whether it be an accident or especially on purpose, is it too much to ask to leave innocent children out of it????? I mean, seriously. As a mother, I just feel sick when I read this and stories like this where children are brought into conflicts that they aren’t and never would have been a part of. Just so so sad.
This woman makes me sick. I read every article and story about her that I find and I’m just sick and angry with her. She threw it all away on what I think was a wild goose chase.
Here’s my ‘analysis’ of some things asked in the article:
“What was said that made her get out of the van and put the phone on the divider? What made her drive away in the opposite direction they would have thought she was going in to look for her?”
I’m willing to speculate her and her husband were separated or separating, possibly because of her drinking problem, and she couldn’t handle that on top of her already unstable emotions. There’s a lot that makes me think she suffered from Borderline Personality Disorder, the compulsive spending, the drinking and drugs, and the need to control everything – like not inviting her mother to the wedding, and demanding a non menu item from the restaurant. Even if that’s a broad leap, I still think everything that happened that day was about control.
I think when she was on the phone, she was freaking out. She probably threatened or said that she was going to hurt herself somehow and I’m sure this probably wasn’t the first time so they didn’t take it as seriously as they should have. She probably drank and drank and drank for hours leading up to leaving her husband and going home to squash the panic and fear of what would happen after the “vacation” was over and everybody went back to real life. The real life where she was miserable and her husband couldn’t stand her. While on the phone they probably told her they were going to call the police and she knew that if she got caught she would have to go to jail or the psych ward. She ditched the phone so it couldn’t be traced, and went back the way she came so nobody would catch up to her. She maybe only planned to lead them on a wild goose chase and hide away until she was promised unconditional love and forgiveness, or maybe she did plan to crash the car and take everybody down with her as punishment for not loving her the way she felt she needed, or maybe she was just so wasted that one mistake led to another. BPD’s suffer from black and white thinking. No gray area exists. The second they disapproved of her behavior was the second they stopped loving her, in her head.
That’s my thought. None of it is any excuse for what happened. Shame on her for not getting help, and if you’re reading this Daniel, SHAME ON YOU for letting this happen to your children. What she did to herself was her problem and hers alone but those were your CHILDREN. I’m sure you’re so spineless that you let her use them as pawns against you many times and you should have stood up for them. You should have protected them. That’s what daddy’s do, and that’s what they needed you to do. The SICKEST part of this whole subplot with you Daniel is that YOUR OWN CHILDREN recognized that they needed your help before you were ever able to give it to them. I hope to god if you ever have any more children, you get a backbone with them you worthless shit.
Harley: Really liked what you wrote and your analysis!
When I first heard about this case, I assumed it was just a sad story of drunk driving, but I’m more and more convinced that this was a planned, calculate suicide/murder tragedy.
My take is that the mom had a fight with her husband at the campground that night (perhaps they discussed a separation or a “things aren’t working out” talk) and then the next morning, Diane truly did leave the campground sober and seemingly fine. Many times, right before a suicide, people appear to be eerily serene.
She obviously planned to drink, since she packed the bottle of vodka that was normally to stay in the camper, and then she got orange juice from Mcdonalds (her coworkers later said that her favorite drink was a screwdriver).
She lit a pre-rolled joint up after McDonalds and smoked and drank in the van (the kids were quite young and probably didn’t truly understand what she was doing). Importantly, if she drinks often (which I think she does) then it’s easy to come off as “normal” in public, even if you have a buzz going. I don’t think she got truly plastered until close to the accident, when I think she started jugging the vodka in preparation for the crash.
She did it on purpose, to kill herself and to cause harm to others in her life. Obviously this woman had severe problems, and just b/c her family or friends didn’t pick up on it (supposedly) doesn’t mean they weren’t there. In fact, from the Newsday article, it seems pretty clear to me that Diane was a person who rarely if ever revealed herself, which can cause an overwhelming sense of isolation and bottled up rage inside.
What makes me mad is the husband literally acting as though she was perfect and did absolutely nothing wrong. I don’t think his lawyer is very good actually, b/c the husband should be told not to act like she was an angel, as that’s not credible (no one is as perfect as he’s claiming).
Very strange story. There is something definitely not right here, and I hope that one day all will be revealed. Very well thought out write up by the way.
It does sound like a murder/suicide, although I don’t see why she would bother filling her gas tank if she was planing on crashing it in a short while. This story has been haunting me; thank you for writing and researching this article, Fuzzy. Justice can never be served, but maybe some day we will have answers as to ‘why’.
She may have filled the van up with gas in case her first plan failed…you know, finding the perfect spot.
She was probably thinking ahead, deciding that IF the one area was too busy, then she would have to scout out another portion of freeway.
Either way…if she wanted to die, she shoulda made her husband drive the kids home in the van, and just offed herself.
The question I’m asking is…what the hell was her motive for killing children along with herself?
I did not read all the comments, but I do like the information presented, the fact that it’s stated that somethings are missing and there are good conclusions.
As far as filling the gas tank
1. She thought the car would explode better with a full tank (false)
2. She knew by filling the tank an explosion is less likely (fumes catch faster than te liquid)
3. She was stilll “on the fense”
Also tank is low – she’s nuts – so certain things are NOT goingto be logical
As far as any coverup goes – MONEY – would there be less made if it’s found to be a suicide vs an act of intoxication with death as an UNintended result????
“As far as any coverup goes – MONEY – would there be less made if it’s found to be a suicide vs an act of intoxication with death as an UNintended result????”
Nice point Fred. We need an insurance adjuster to pop up. Is that even provable? If she was insured (life) wouldn’t the Payor be investigating into that theory if they could duck the payout? One would certainly think so.
For two months, I was an insurance sales agent for a company that sold life insurance. (Turns out I suck at sales, lol.) In our company’s life insurance policies, it was stated that if the insured committed suicide within the first two years of the policy, then there would be no payout. Most or all insurance companies have this clause. If the insured commits suicide before the two-year period is up, the company will usually refund the premiums to the beneficiary.
Why fill up the car with gas? So when she crashed, the car – and all evidence – would burn.
Where can I find her co-worker statements. Those are the people that spend the 2nd most amount of time with her.
Thanks Fuzzy. Interesting.
Thanks Max as well.
The only reference to the coworker ’sheila’ was in one New York Post article early on, and i really don’t think it is substantiated. Just google dina schuler sheila’ and you will find it. Unless someone got to her quickly and got her to remain silent, i think it was made up. No one has come out of the woodwork with any dirt on this chick. She was under the radar all the way, by design i am sure based on her controlling nature.
Here is the link with the supposed ‘drinking buddy’ quote.
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/regional/item_Mr6vxWRqeoQ7jj0oHM4T5L
The only real proof I have of a suicidal unhappiness in Schuler is the implausibility of either a 36 year old mother of two naively and atrociously BINGE drinking 16-18 ounces of vodka out of a 60 ounce bottle or a 36 year old mother of two “functionally” BINGE drinking 16-18 ounces out of a 60 ounce bottle. Only ignorant little girls binge drink into oblivion without forethought or notion of consequence. A 36 year old mother of two binge drinks because she has very serious personal issues or she is suicidal. Likewise, “functional alcoholics” don’t binge drink because such drinking leads to loss of function which is antithetical to the primary goal of the “functional alcoholic. That goal being a perpetual AND FUNCTIONING inebriated state. “Functional alcoholics” would not buy the largest available bottle of alcohol with a total disregard for the potential to get pulled and arrested for drunk driving. But a very depressed woman bent on suicide would buy such a bottle to ensure the job was done and could only wish that a cop would pull her over to give her the real help she needed.
From everything I’ve read about this, I believe this woman killed herself deliberately, along with her own children and the children of her brother, and the adults in the other vehicle. I’ve heard of other female wrong-way driving suicides involving children, and this seems to match the pattern.
What set her off? We may never know. Perhaps a revelation of infidelity (which I have theorized could be between her husband and the sister-in-law ~ which would explain why this is such a cover up. In some sort of effort to not let the deaths of Diane and the children be in vain – since she was driven to that point – all parties feel responsible to cover up. And would explain why she took the children – because she wanted to hurt the sister in-law and take away from her as the sister in-law had done to Diane. It also, could explain the phone calls to the brother ~ she probably called to apologize to him before hand in some cryptic way.) and/or other embarrassing sexual behavior, perhaps even something along the lines of questions rose about the paternity of a child, or something of similarly personally catastrophic nature. I’ve have searched endlessly and can not recovery any pieces of information regarding the marriage of D & D or any information regarding anything inside the history of this family. It could be completely plausible that somehow, some way, something happened inside this family during periods of separation that lead to the sister in-law becoming pregnant and one of the cousins’s actually being a sister to Diane’s children. Possible that this information was discovered previous to the camping trip in at one point the adults made a mature decision to leave the past in the past and move forward for the best interest of the all the children and that burden of carrying that secret was too much for Diane. Maybe while at the camp ground Diane watching all the children playing together and then looking at a man she loves – something broke inside of her and she carefully devised the plan and maybe she was the one calling all the “traveling home” shots and that fully explains why her husband was alone in the truck. She wanted him to live with their blood on his hands.
What happened, in my opinion, is what we will see happen more frequently in a society that claims killing one’s child in utero is a “fundamental right.” We will see more and more mothers mass murdering their children as acts of liberation. This seems to me an entirely predictable result given the nature of our culture. The fact that the liberal media won’t touch such a potential while clinging to the FA theory is also entirely predictable. The FA theory fits nicely with liberal modes of thought while the most plausible scenario casts a very dark shadow over liberalism’s unintended consequences.
Diane Schuler could have stopped so many times before she caused all this mayhem and death. In fact, she passively tried to stop herself on at least two occasions. The first was early on with the erratic and impatient driving (which at that point I believe it was rage that was causing her to driving that way – not the alcohol at that time.) and the second time when she called her brother. Yet, notice the pattern. When she was “visible” at the campground and at McDonalds she made sure to put on a good face and stay focused on her liberation. When she was “invisible” in the car and in the conversation with her brother, she was passively, but consciously crying for someone to stop her.
On last thing I’d like to point out here, is that I truly and whole heartily think that Diane’s autopsy coming back with Pot and Alcohol in her system was just a catalyst for this cover up. I belief that her family knows exactly what drover her to this point of insanity and walked around for days sick. Sick at the lost of their children, wife, sister, friend and positively ill knowing that it was rooted on them and that not only was she going to be shamed – the whole family was going to be shamed and brought down. I think Diane’s position with her company financially enabled these people to pay how they needed to spin out via media that the alcohol and drugs were found in her system and then to re-spin it like that was the “BIG DIRTY SECRET” that they don’t want out – hence fooling everything to focus on the drinking and not the real issue.
I for one minute do not believe this woman was an FA or and alcoholic of any sort. I think she was a very depressed and emotionally tormented woman with a touch of narcissism that in her state wanted out and wanted, what in her mind was justice. I believe that even with her grand delusions being in that state of mind ~ she needed to enable the inability to change her mind. I believe she was drunk and high and I believe that was just to get her to the “other side” so to speak. If you want to know what, how, when, where and why … someone will need to dig a little in to those families’ closet.
Very interesting analsyis melynn. The ny magazine article has the only background information i have found (linked from my article).
I have to disagree with your theory about the sister in law and the husband having an affair though. They lived in very different worlds it seems to me. And in different classes. The in laws seemed to have it all. A big house in the old neighboorhood (floral park). The brother in law is in real estate, the wife is athetic, running marathons and in great shape. The schulers lived out in suffolk county, in a small house. By looking at them they are not in the best shape. I think the husband was chosen based on his dullard qualities, he seems distanced from any sort of emotional development and was probably manipulated by diane. Again, read the linked article. I think if anything she was involved with a stranger to the others (maybe the wrong number guy?). Something happened that weekend of course. I bet she told the husband she was leaving and he had no clue why or that anything was missing in their relationship. Then her brother probably called her on being drunk, heard the whole story and went off on her. That could have drove her over the edge.
Anyway, i agree that she was not a regular binge drinker but knew the effects of vodka. She did smoke a lot of pot though apparently, which could cause paranoia. I think she was being challenged by people she did not respect, her clueless husband not understanding anything about her and her brother, who knew all the buttons to push.
Interesting discussion, i enjoyed your post.
Oh, Fuzzy Wuzzy. Have you not ever watched at least one episode of Desperate Housewives? I wouldn’t be so quick to dismiss my theory about the sister in law and the husband having an affair.
Opposites attract very, very much especially for two very bored and ingnored married people that are pursuing an affair full of passion and lust. It’s that naughtiness of it all that creates that explosion – and a part of that is the idea of the forbidden. And once something like this type of affair starts it’s perfectly common for one or both parties to get so caught up in the feeling of being alive and desired that something goes astray and some deeper darker secret is created. Hence my theory on the half-siblings.
With that said, I can not find this link you speak of and I am overly curious.
http://nymag.com/news/features/62043/
heres the link.
Sorry but i still don’t buy it. He was happy as a pig in shit with her, i really think it was her, not him.
Fuzz … I read that article. While, I’ll admit it was VERY well written as the author is clearly brilliant as he lays out the map for all the BS, it also think still reeks BS. That Danny boy is either dumber then a box of rocks or he just blatantly doesn’t care and is going to lie to the end. The whole family. But I loved how it was interjected with all the contradictions. Very, Very cleaver!
I just found this article. It’s changing my conspiracy theory …..
http://www.expertclick.com/NewsReleaseWire/ReleaseDetails.aspx?ID=28193&CFID=1568086&CFTOKEN=77020581
Melynn, I hope to see more of your posts.
Now, what is FA?
Functional alcoholic, I believe.
That is correct Max.
So that would make me an RFA? A Recovering Functional Alcoholic?
Guilt is what has kept diane’s family from telling the whole story. They all knew about her drinking and pot smoking but still allowed her to take thier children on vacation. They won’t tell the whole story because that means they would have to accept some degree of responsibility for the deaths of thier children.
I would say it’s both guilt and self-preservation. If it was guilt alone, they would have been more forth-coming in the investigation.
Fuzzy damn good write up! Damn good. I enjoyed your writing. But I hate the story. I am having problems holding back. The anger for the father knowing she had a problem and was not to be trusted at all. The lazyness not to do anythign to keep his children and the other children safe. And later the disgust over keeping her name clear to keep his own ass safe. I really hope I get a chance to visit that area to pay this scumbag a visit.
Max thank you for posting Fuzzy’s write up.
As to why it is being deleted from ther sites? Simple they are not as informed as you are over the laws dealing with public domain. The lawyers use big lawyer speak and scare people in to taking it down. But you know the law is on your side.
So what I’m going to do is post a direct link to this page from my blog. Then post a link in Facebook, then myspace. How about that shit eh? Fuck the shitheads who would cover this up.
FW – Good article. I am not usually a fan of people writing down their speculations, but in this instance, I am making an exception. I, too, thought murder/suicide when I first read the original article about this tragedy. The phone on the wall was the smoking gun for me. That shows a lot of presence of mind.
Max – Thank you for having the courage to publish this. I am from Long Island (now living in Florida, but all my family is still on the Island). It is the living land of the Stepfords. People are quite up in arms about this and have gone so far as to make death threats to those who are questioning Ms. Schuler’s sanity. The Long Island community is very protective of their own as a whole, lest property values of their homes dare go down due to a dose of bad publicity (end: sarcasm). Brave decision on your part to put this post up. Undoubtedly, you are going to get some hate mail over this…but you have a section for that, so at least you are prepared.
melynn, looks like i ran out of reply buttons….
So you are changing your theory to what? That she was an alcoholic? I read that article you linked, it is from August and does contain several inaccuracies. I do think she was a drinker, but not normal to binge like that. That was for a reason. She was probably sucking down vodka regularaly at home at night when danny was at work, but probably neer interfered with her life. The day of the crash she was drunk yes, but still managed to control her vehicle without going off the road or hitting a tree. She was in control enough to drive to her doom.
But whether she was an alcoholic or not, i think her excessive drinking that day was precipitated by some event that Danny boy is well aware of, but refuses to admit. btw, I have met boxes of rocks smarter than that Nedanderthal (i am a geologist and some of my best friends are rocks). I think she kept him around because he did not challenge her, she was happy to have him not question anything she did. So something had to have happened (to quote danny), and he knows what it is. Obviously he is still in denial to the family.
The Hance’s have stated ‘we don’t know what goes on on that side of the family” and at one point the Hances own lawyer stated that they had broken ties with the Schulers. That statement was immediately retracted however, for obvious reasons. I think the Hances have remained silent also for obvious reasons…
That article states they lived seperate lives during the week, so who knows what each was really up to. But Danny did not seem to think anything was amis, even when their communication amounted to her telling him the gutters need cleaning. I have more in depth conversations with the guy who pumps my gas! His terrible performances at his press confernce and with Larry King scream deception to me. According to the police report, he made an appointment to be interviewed by the police and kept them waiting through the press conference, only to refuse to talk to the police afterwards. PR was his main objective.
And why the Larry King show? He was trying to convince himself what he was saying was true. I think the truth is probably eating the guy alive. How could you feel no guilt, or anything? He only feels it in terms of his own loss. Very immature emotionally.
fyi , here are the inaccuracies in this article.
http://www.expertclick.com/NewsReleaseWire/ReleaseDetails.aspx?ID=28193&CFID=1568086&CFTOKEN=77020581
a broken bottle of Absolut vodka was found near the wreck.
The bottle was found in the vehicle under the passenger seat, reportedly a few days after the crash. I read a blog post somewhere where someone claiming to be an ER nurse when they brought her in said it was immediately obvious she had been drinking due to the odor of alcohol.
> State police, however, according to media reports “investigated” why Schuler, 36, a Cablevision executive, would have been driving the wrong way on a highway she had driven numerous times before.
This road is not on the route she ever would have taken to get to the campground, rather she made at least 2 wrong turns, getting on highways going away from Long Island.
>…he said, “She did not drink. She is not an alcoholic” However, the facts belie the claim. Schuler later modified his claim, telling investigators that his wife drank socially and “occasionally” smoked pot.
While he stated this in public, he had initially did tell the police she drank that weekend and that she smoked pot. I found no evidence he changed his story to the police, rather it was what he said in public that was inconsistent.
>While she was confused enough while on the road to call her brother, Warren Hance, to ask for directions home, he said there was “no slurred speech,” as if that’s the norm in someone under the influence.
Later reports say she was slurring and called Warren by her husbands name; nothing about the account of this phone call is reliable however in my opinion based on its wording, its all words put in her mouth.
>New York Post reported that a “drinking buddy” of Diane’s said, “She liked her drinks, she liked her vodka” (reportedly in screwdrivers).
This claim was never substantiated and only reported in the New York Post, so take it with a margarita’s worth of salt.
You’re right .. I go back to my origional theory. ESPECIALLY now that you point out hat the Hances has broken ties before. ~ Something happened and it was deep. I said it before. If we want to know what, we have to dig deeper then this surface.
Also, just the mere fact that her brother was worried enough after the phone call to rush out of the house and try to find her tells me that he knew what she was capable of.
If a relative called me and said she wasn’t feeling well I would have called the police, asked her to wait where she was, and then gone out to find her… but I wouldn’t have been panicked to the point that I felt everyone’s life in the car was in jeopardy. That tells me that the brother knew that Diane either had a drinking problem, or had severe emotional problems and had the potential to harm herself and others.
Clearly the family knew something was wrong (perhaps not to the degree some posters here are claiming though).
At the end of the day, I think that if her husband had been honest after this tragedy and said “I should have seen the warning signs, etc”, people would be more sympathetic.. it’s the blatant lying and denials that are bothering people.
To me, she is the only one to blame. The only way anyone else is to blame is if people actually knew she was drunk when she FIRST left the campground, and nothing was done. I feel that she didn’t start drinking or smoking until she left McDonalds. Remember, the crash occurred 4 HOURS after she left the campground, which is plenty of time to get totally wasted.
In January of 2008, in my home state of Massachusetts, a woman named Marci Thibault was driving with her niece and nephew in her car when she reversed direction on the interstate and then proceeded to pull over, strip them all naked and carry them into oncoming traffic on the highway, killing all 3. (Link to story is below). She had not been drinking or doing drugs, but her brother said she seemed perfectly fine when she left his house.
The Diane Schuler story immediately called this to mind and I have believed from day 1 that it was a murder/suicide.
FuzzyWuzzy – excellent reporting…very very good. Max needs to put you on his payroll.
My only thoughts:
In no way do I hold the Hances responsible and I really don’t think that they would cover for her at this point when she killed their three daughters. Maybe they should have called the cops first, but again, in panic we do not always follow the logical route. I am wondering what would make the Hances not want to reveal everything that was said in those phone calls..I’m not convinced that they are hiding anything as I don’t see the benefit to them to do so…
http://www.boston.com/news/local/massachusetts/articles/2008/01/19/deaths_of_aunt_2_children_called_murder_suicide/
Holy – This is so beyong horrific. But this one is much easier explained. I went searching for more information after reading the article you posted. I read a lot … but I found this ….
“Four months earlier Thibault had been treated at McLean Hospital for a psychotic episode. She was discharged after six days with medication and a referral for outpatient treatment. Between her discharge and her death she was said to be 95 percent back to her old self.
On her way to her sister’s home Marci Thibault came to the attention of the state police. She apparently drove into the median area at full speed. When a motorist stopped to offer help she began to punch him. State police came to the site and questioned her. She told them she was having “a debate between good and evil.” The troopers considered committing her to a psychiatric hospital, but she calmed down, and they concluded they did not have enough evidence to do so.”
Marci was a schizophrenic. The incidence of Schizophrenia is slightly higher in men than women. Negative symptoms (e.g., social withdrawal, lack of motivation, flat emotions) tend to predominate in men; whereas depressive episodes, paranoid delusions, and hallucinations tend to predominate in women.
Schizophrenia usually starts between the late teens and the mid-30s. Usually the onset of Schizophrenia occurs a few years earlier in men than women. The onset may be abrupt or insidious. Usually Schizophrenia starts gradually with a pre-psychotic phase of increasing negative symptoms (e.g., social withdrawal, deterioration in hygiene and grooming, unusual behavior, outbursts of anger, and loss of interest in school or work). A few months or years later, a psychotic phase develops (with delusions, hallucinations, or grossly bizarre/disorganized speech and behavior). Individuals who have an onset of Schizophrenia later in their 20’s or 30’s are more often female, have less evidence of structural brain abnormalities or cognitive impairment, and display a better outcome. Schizophrenia usually persists, continuously or episodically, for a life-time. Complete remission (i.e., a return to full pre-morbid functioning) is uncommon.
The life expectancy of individual with Schizophrenia is shorter than that of the general population for a variety of reasons. Suicide is an important factor, because approximately 10% of individuals with Schizophrenia commit suicide – and between 20% and 40% make at least one suicide attempt. There is an increased risk of assaultive and violent behavior. Sometimes a suicide is methodically planned and deliberately committed. At other times, a suicide may be accidental – that is, the victim is acting out a hallucination or delusion when in a psychotic state. Families caution that in either of the above situations, there are some preventive measures you can take, although you can never guard completely against the possibility of suicide.
The first-degree biological relatives of individuals with Schizophrenia have a risk for Schizophrenia that is about 10 times greater than that of the general population. Concordance rates for Schizophrenia are higher in monozygotic (identical) twins than in dizygotic (fraternal) twins. The existence of a substantial discordance rate in monozygotic twins also indicates the importance of environmental factors.
Most families reported that a crisis or psychotic episode – that is, a severe break with reality – occurred a few months to a year after they began to notice unusual behavior. Some said, however, that the crisis occurred with little or no warning.
During a crisis episode, your relative will exhibit some or all of the following symptoms: hallucinations, delusions, thought disorder, and disturbances in behavior and emotions. Families who have been through these psychotic episodes warn that no amount of preparation can fully protect you from the shock, panic, and sickening dread you will feel when your relative enters this stage of schizophrenia. Understand also that your relative may be as terrified as you are by what is happening: “voices” may be giving life-threatening commands; snakes may be crawling on the window; poisonous fumes may be filling the room. You must get medical help for your relative as quickly as possible, and this could mean hospitalization. If your relative has been receiving medical help, phone the doctor or psychiatrist immediately. Ask which hospital you should go to and for advice about what to do.
Relapse can occur for a number of reasons, as well as for no apparent reason. Sometimes the ill person has stopped taking medication for a long enough period of time for acute symptoms to reappear. Sometimes the dosage of medication is not high enough to prevent the return of acute symptoms. Perhaps the person afflicted is not receiving enough support, either at home or from community services. Perhaps the individual has recently experienced some severe mental stress – the death of a loved one, the loss of a job, the move to a new place to live. Sometimes the individual is simply physically exhausted, or is using alcohol or street drugs in an effort to feel “better” briefly. Sometimes the cause may be something that can be dealt with quite easily. For example, medication can be increased, a brief hospital stay can be arranged, and more support can be found. Sometimes a psychotic episode will involve violence. Because of the altered state of reality, he or she may try to act out the hallucination – for example, shatter a window. Threats to harm him or herself, to hurt you, or to damage property. One mother said that her son kept yelling that God was ordering him to kill her.
Persons with schizophrenia are often more at ease with children than with adults. Although this does not indicate a sexual interest, it can, especially with men and children, lead to potential concerns. It is behavior that should be carefully monitored. Young girls with schizophrenia are vulnerable to sexual advances from adults. For men in the younger age groups, homosexual approaches may occur and may be experienced as frightening. In large cities, such approaches are not uncommon, and reassurance is needed that nothing in your relative’s behavior or appearance has triggered the approach.
I know someone who’s seen Diane’s toxicology and autopsy reports firsthand, and knew how to interpret them correctly. The levels of alcohol and THC in her system were so high it was surprising she was able to walk into that gas station, and there wasn’t any evidence of a stroke or aneurysm or any other kind of ‘medical emergency’ – she may have had high blood glucose if she ate fast food and was drinking alcohol, but that still wouldn’t really fit with what happened. However, if it was so high as to be an emergency, why would she dump her phone when it would’ve been her primary way to obtain emergency medical help?
My first thought was that if what her family had said was true, perhaps a revelation of child abuse or something drove her to the alcohol and marijuana. However, since she seemed to be trying to prevent the children from calling her parents, I think that either a) she completely snapped and had some sort of psychotic/bipolar/manic episode, or b) the children were about to inform the brother and sister-in-law of something she had done and that caused her to kill herself. Since she could’ve easily walked into traffic on her own, the question as to why she would kill the children as well still remains – perhaps she either wanted to hurt her husband and relatives, or permanently silence the children?
FYI, links to:
Autopsy and Toxicology report
http://longisland.newsday.com/data/pdfs/Diane%20Schuler%20autopsy.pdf
15-page police report
http://www.autopsyfiles.org/reports/policereport/schuler,%20diane_police_report.pdf
Victims Lawsuit
http://www.lohud.com/assets/pdf/BH1482601210.PDF
There are some more out there i couldn’t find active links to, such as the 8-page accident report and 46 pages of witness interviews. I have pdfs if pysih wants to host them.
I’ve read this pieces few times now. I’ve also reread news articles regarding this incident. It seems that many people have a great desire to uncover truth here, but yet, are willing to be led by speculation. FuzzyWuzzy’s piece can not be described as journalism in any way, perhaps more as theory and speculation. This does not make it bad; it is merely important that those interested in truth remember the difference between fact and opinion. This piece by FuzzyWuzzy is more of an op-ed, and I see that even as a stretch. However, I do understand the point of writing this perspective.
As for the “why did this happened”…My instinct says that Diane Schuler was likely suffering from a mental disorder that had escalated over time, unchecked and uncontrolled. Honestly though, it was likely not unnoticed, just ignored. Given the drugs, drinking, and the shopping binges reported here and elsewhere, bipolar disorder seems likely. I can only imagine that the family members involved realized the severity of the situation only when faced with the calls from the road. If Diane were not a trusted person, no parent would have allowed their children in the car with her.
Diane’s husband seems to be painted as a bit of a monster by the media, but in truth, we must accept that he is dealing with his guilt and grief in a way that only he knows. If attempting to prove his wife innocent of a crime helps him to cope, he is allowed that right. His children are dead. His wife is dead. I suspect he cannot wrap his head around this quite yet. Is he clutching at straws claiming her innocence? Probably. But he is doing what he needs to make sense of all of this.
It is true that the content of the phone calls lies with the families. However, in no way is there proof that anything in these calls triggered the ensuing events. There is no proof that this was premeditated. Diane was intoxicated while driving, and very likely in a fugue state that, had she lived, she would not recall. Vodka is a common choice of alcoholics who are attempting to be functional because it leaves no residual odor on one’s breath. The bottle found in the accident was likely her car stash. Drunk drivers care little about open bottle laws.
Those of us who see ourselves as “sane” and define sanity in some way that precludes partaking this sort of event…will never truly understand how such a thing could happen. We can attempt to rationalize it, and use what we see as logic to plow through ambiguity and hazy facts to attempt to explain irradict behavior. But when faced with possible mental illness, rational thought seldom helps to shed light. Getting behind the wheel while intoxicated is never, ever rational.
I see nothing but Diane living a lie and getting away with it until the day that she died. This is a common thread amongst alcoholics. Are these events the fault of the family members who might have known, should have known, but did nothing to stop Diane? No, the blame is solely Diane’s.
All we can do is look at the patterns exposed in this incident and identify them in ourselves or loved ones. And, hopefully, prevent any similar future incidents.
I like your post fuzzy logic. My piece is of course based entirely on speculation, with facts to back up the model. I haven’t found too many facts that are outliers of my ‘novel’ however. I merely put my thoughts down.
No one ever said i was not insane, in fact many have, i mean look at the depths i was driven to by this story. Perhaps it hits too close to home in ways i don’t want to admit, or i am trying to convince myself i could never go off like that. No one wants their family dynamics to be spashed across the front page for 6 months, none of us, period.
Of course i have sympathy for Danny, how could you not? And for the in-laws who lost their family. They were caught completely off guard by this i am sure, espeically the mom of all those kids. How that family can go on day to day is beyond me; their grief and anger must dwarf anything we can imagine. And Danny’s way of grieving is of course valid and he is doing what he has to do to survive, its just that he flaunted it in the media when everthing was so fresh. Over many years, and learned from personal experience, the best advice i can ever give people who have sustained a loss is not to hold the way anyone around them handles their own grief, or deals with adressing your grief. People react differently, from ignoring it, to making stupid comments, to going on a crusade, whatever it takes is valid for them, and getting righteous about how someone else handles what is their most personal inner feelings is pretty self-centered. I can’t say i am not guilty of this, but, when you do it at self-sponsered press conferences and on national tv shows you are asking to be judged in a black and white court and you must be prepared to have your grief-stricken irrational mindset dissected.
Fuzzy Logic:
Excellent points. I have also read much about this case, and appreciate the discussions here. We are all speculating really, b/c we simply don’t know enough to make a first hand conclusion. I think you are right on with your theory that she had an undiagnosed mental disorder.
Several items stuck in my mind from the various articles on this case.
1) She “didn’t believe in medication,” and didn’t even have a primary care physician, making an undiagnosed disorder all the more likely.
2) The incredibly impulsive behavior: Binge drinking, pot smoking at age 36 with children (not to say everyone who smokes pot is irresponsible or impulsive), but very few people, even teens, smoke and drive with children in the car.
3) The shopping impulsivity: How many middle-class people go out for milk and return with a jeep or a flat-screen tv? This is not normal behavior.
4) From all the reports, she had an emotionally distant husband, who didn’t seen to understand the absurdity when he said he knew all of his wife’s needs and desires, such as “when the gutters needed to be cleaned.” That says it all really.
I think she had Borderline personality disorder as well (although it’s very difficult to diagnose someone after the fact), and binge drinking was one of her many impulsive behaviors. I don’t think she was an alcoholic, but like many BPD sufferers, she did everything in excess.
Pros and Cons of what was written:
Pros – it adds a dimension to the events that I did not know while following the story.
Cons – Max, you add so much personal speculation about what took place, you begin to loose my appreciation for your due diligence.
Ex. The McDonald’s connection? I could just as easily say that I’m 100% certain that if she were drunk, they would’ve called the police. And if they didn’t because 1. she wasn’t, 2. she didn’t appear to be, or 3. they wouldn’t know if she was or wasn’t, McDonald’s and the employees are not trained to spot drunks and report them. Also, while you would hope they would report a drunk driver, failure to do so would not result in any criminal or civil lawsuit (that doesn’t mean that they wouldn’t be sued).
Ex. She walked in the gas station looking for Tylenol? That’s your speculation. Her walking in, looking around and leaving after saying something to the clerk is enough for me. What was said to the clerk is the key, not you guessing what was said.
Ex. Her speeding out of the gas station? Was she and was her pulling into traffic as you say it was? My point is that the camera filming her actions is on time lapse. Watch her walking across the parking lot – she is “skipping” because of the delay, which speeds up her actions. The same will be true for her driving out of the gas station – she will appear to drive faster than she is. Also, there is no way to make a competent conclusion about her safety entering the road with this footage. We can’t see left or right and the cars will appear to be driving faster than they are. Also, she poured more vodka and OJ? Not needed with all the other great stuff you have.
Your other facts, about her turning around, leaving the phone, etc are excellent tidbits that I had no idea about.
Try leaving out the personal commentary and repost to the websites that took it off. I bet they leave it up.
Pros and Cons of your comment
Pros
1) Reasoned commentary
Cons
1) Misdirected at Max, despite attribution in italics in the post.
2) Your argument that this, an expansion and support of a comment on the preceding post, despite extensive evaluation, as a comment, seems mildly hypocritical. This is like a letter to an editor.
Jake
Ex. The McDonald’s connection? (that doesn’t mean that they wouldn’t be sued).
This was my only point on this, that if the manager and the clerk talked about it later and said ‘ohhh shit, we are screwed’ by the time the cops get to them they say what they need to say to avoid being sued.
Ex. She walked in the gas station looking for Tylenol? That’s your speculation.
It is well publicized in the news that she supposedly asked for tylenol at the gas station, i didn’t make that up, but of course have no ‘proof’ that is what she was looking for or what was said. In fact the police report says that clerk refused to be interviewed, so this comes from Tom Ruskin and Dumbinic Barbarian.
Ex. Her speeding out of the gas station?
Now this i take sexception with, i watched that tape over and over again and it is not the absolute speed of her vehicle. I say right away the video was not linear with respect to time. What i looked at was the relative positions of the moving vehicles and how much each moved frame by frame. This made it clear that her vehicle moved much farther than any other in the parking lot. The clincher for me was studying the acceleration of her pulling away from the pumps, you can see the van lurch as she hits the gas, indicating a rapid acceleration. Then the van leans into the turn she makes as she whips around 180 degrees. In the time it takes to make that turn another car in the video moves only one car length while hers travels probably 100 feet. ALso, this is a shortened vidoe, there is a >5 min one out there where she is shown pulling out and making a left and exiting the frame.
I wonder if she was maybe yelling at the kids and that’s why she drove so crazy and then went the wrong way onto the Taconic.
Thanks very much, Fuzzy. I have to admit I’ve been fascinated with this case… less so by what she did than by how her family reacted.
First, I love this site, I love how thorough and complete the facts and details are.
I think the author makes grandiose statements left and right throughout this “article” it’s not an article…it’s an opinion piece. Some of his accusations are probably well founded while others are in my opinion, completely off the wall and completely unsubstantiated. Although it seems he was able to examine all the evidence put forth thoroughly he did not really present most of it here (for example when he refers to the 10th page of the police report but doesn’t show it to us for review)
But anyway’s, If i were in a similar situation that my sister called me shortly before she caused an accident which killed herself and her 5 children…I certainly wouldn’t protect her. I would be enraged and disgusted that she murdered 5 innocent children. I would totally throw my drunken sisters butt under the bus.
I have to agree that the author makes a keen observation about the way she was driving, but oddly enough in the surveillance video she doesn’t seem disgruntled or aggressive in her actions, she seems very normal except when she begins driving.
I have never heard about this case except for when I read this piece and I must ask, isn’t it easy enough to figure out if she was intoxicated at the time of her death by reading the autopsy report from the coroner’s office? Excuse my ignorance but what would be the benefit in the police and other officials have in covering up this tragedy? Could anyone enlighten me at all?
By the way i COMPLETELY disagree with the argument that “functional alcoholics” wouldn’t purchase large quantities of alcohol. I have a family member who is a recovering “functional alcoholic” who would drink an entire handle of vodka or bacardi everynight and get up and be productive at work the entire next day. (just as a side note)
and i’m sorry not to monopolize…but I see the evidence provided by Fuzzy Wuzzy in a reply, and now i can read the background of the story too. thanks Fuzzy, good work up on your POV of the facts
>Excuse my ignorance but what would be the benefit in the police and other officials have in covering up this tragedy? Could anyone enlighten me at all?
No.
Answer to both questions. There is no reason, motivation, or logic to why any officals would cover it up. The family had argued they got the samples mixed up or whatever. But it was a boring July Sunday afternoon, there were no other mass-casualty events to mix them up with. I never saw the point of disputing the only actual facts in the case and making up excuses that are way more crazy than mine.
And as i have stated many times, these speculations are mine and mine alone and were developed by letting my overactive imagination run wild with the limited facts and media coverage. I would not have done this if the truth was simply told in the first place. And i don’t think the other family is involved in a coverup, but what is the point of hashing it out in public. They are the discrete ones dealing with their losses privately while the husband has sought out the public eye. You get what you deserve if you put yourself out there.
Interesting perspective. I think the murder-suicide theory is valid, but just as a theory (as you have said). However, I don’t think it explains what she did that day any more satisfactorily than the theory that she was drunk and stoned, freaked out when she realized her family knew where she was and were coming to meet her (thereby discovering her state) and tried desperately to make it home despite being totally impaired so as to not deal with her brother’s wrath. Her “scouting out” the location of the crash is certainly a possibility, but it doesn’t make any more sense, in my opinion, then her simply having gotten turned around and winding up driving the wrong way on the same stretch of highway she was just on. Regardless, whether she intentionally killed herself and the children with a total lack of regard for whomever else crashed into, or decided to drown her sorrows in pot and booze while driving with five kids in the car and refusing help when it was offered to her, reveals her to be a controlling, self-absorbed person with little or no regard for the well being of others. It’s pretty bad for her soul either way.
Question: I know several calls to the brother were made. Some were made by a child in the car, but wasn’t at least one made by Diane herself? At the very least, we know she did say (supposedly) that she wasn’t feeling well.
One would think that if she intended to hide the problem (drunkenness) she would NOT have said this to her brother. Let’s say the niece called her father and said something was wrong, if Diane wanted to cover it up, she could have said “Oh no, everything’s fine; I have a slight headache but I’m fine,” or the equivalent. Obviously she said something that compelled her brother to leave the house and find her.
That kind of disputes your idea that she was panicked about her brother trying to find her and discovering she had been drinking. I feel the multiple phone calls were an irrational cry for help, or made before she got to the point that she was totally plastered.
I don’t know, I’m still on the fence about this being a planned murder/suicide, versus a drunk/high woman crashing her car. If the intent from the start was to kill herself and her kids, why allow a child to call in the first place, or why even tell her brother there was a problem?
Any ideas?
Matt
As i said above, those phone calls are key. We probably will never know who dialed all the calls from the car. From what i recall, Diane supposedly called on the earlier side with their ETA and let the kids talk to their mother. She was apparently lucid at that time. The later calls from the Tappan Zee Bridge.. Who knows. Regardless of who made the calls, i do not believe the accounts given that she complaining of medical aliments in a coherent way, if she was slurring and confusing who she was talking too then it was probably her brothers word describing her condition. The sister in law was never interviewed, so we do not know the real story here.
i think whe she went into that gas station she wasnt looking for pain reliever like ever gas stations have but maybe she was looking of liquor….not beer. they have beer but maybe they didnt have vodka or what have you? she did look crazed. i had to live with a manipulator for 20 years she is one i can tell just my seeing her on that video. i kmow u say how can u tell, well when u suffer mental abuse from a manipulator for so long u can see them from a mile away coming at you….trust me u know when u know.
i think whe she went into that gas station she wasnt looking for pain reliever like ever gas stations have but maybe she was looking of liquor….not beer. they have beer but maybe they didnt have vodka or what have you? she did look crazed. i had to live with a manipulator for 20 years she is one i can tell just my seeing her on that video. i kmow u say how can u tell, well when u suffer mental abuse from a manipulator for so long u can see them from a mile away coming at you….trust me u know when u know.
I agree, the way she looked around that place was like she was looking for shelves of booze or coolers, she did not look at the counter or behind it where they would normally have something like tylenol. Just curious wtfcrazy, what you saw in her that suggested your observation of manipulator?
I disagree on this point.
Diane, as a woman who clearly drank often and/or in excess, surely knew that only liquor stores in New York sell liquor… you can’t buy liquor at a gas station or grocery store in NY.. everyone knows that, and certainly a woman who drinks regularly would know that.
Perhaps she asked the gas station attendant if there was a liquor store nearby.
I have no horse in this race I barely remember hearing about this on the news when it happened. And I stopped reading approximately half way through. As a criminal investigator myself (computer forensics, fraud, financial crimes) I have to tell you this is a fairly amusing ‘investigation’ YOu make these suppositions and then pass them off as fact. This is 1 example: “She then has to stop for gas too where she is probably looking for Tylenol since she is hung over. But her sister in law said she didn’t believe in medicine, so why was she looking for Tylenol?”
In two sentences she has gone from “probably looking for Tylenol” to “so why was she looking for Tylenol”?
The entire structure of this article, investigation whatever Fuzzwuzzy has done here is full of these types of comments, guesses and supposition that suddenly become stated as fact.
I understand you guys are trying to be entertaining and all but I am going to do some supposition here and guess that this stuff has been yanked from other sites due to these types of comments.
Investigations would be incredibly easy if I could fill in the blanks with my own guesswork like has been done here. Something in the chain of evidence doesn’t fit? Jam it in there and make it fit. However, were I to do something like this with a case that goes to trial beyond prosecutorial misconduct I couldn’t sleep with myself if I ginned up information like this.
The whole paragraph about the vodka and what beer drinkers drink, how long a bottle should last is again presented as a complete series of guesses, comments on human behavior with no back up and ultimately no relevance to the real issue here.
This is actually a pretty good site but I think you lower the quality of the site by posting stuff like this.
Fuzzywuzzy don’t quit your day job you don’t have the patience to develop fact or you are hoping for sensationalism and if the latter is true that is fine just do yourself a favor and make sure you spell that out when you do that kind of stuff. I do notice that the post right above this by you there is you talking about she is looking for booze and Tylenol again. She is dead, you have no proof about this at all. have some decency and retract that stuff. And if you ever get proof of the theory then you can boldly and openly state it.
John, you miss the point of this specific article entirely. Fuzzy wrote this as speculation. “An Interesting Perspective.”
This is a very complicated case that has several entries on this site alone. Fuzzy, in my opinion, has some very interesting ideas. Sure they’re based on gut feelings after Fuzzy was steeped in all available information. We know that it’s not fact. We will probably never know the facts in this case because the Schuler family are a bunch of self-serving crackpots. So we guess. If this was to be admitted in court, surely it would be shot down. But here on a blog? C’mon man, get a grip.
“The entire structure of this article, investigation whatever Fuzzwuzzy has done here is full of these types of comments, guesses and supposition that suddenly become stated as fact.”
No, it’s a bunch of comments, guesswork and supposition based on evidence that has been stated as opinion. You just didn’t absorb that small detail.
John
Maybe you should have some familiarity with the story before posting. It was everywhere for months, so no idea how you missed it.
I don’t believe i stated anything as fact; it is all my complete speculation. IF you bothered to read it, you would have seen me state that over and over.
I stand by the contention that my ‘pulled out of the air’ conclusions, make more sense then what the family and their lawyers and investigators have tried to shove down our throats as explainations. You say I jammed in guesswork, well how are we expected to believe that anbesol caused it, that she was burned in the fire and turned her blood to alcohol, or that she had a TIA or some other completely irrational claim by the family. If you followed the story you would have heard these things coming out day after day.
Hey, i said it before, if you put yourself out there like this expect to be hammered by absurd speculations until you come clean with the truth. I have no intention of quitting my day job, and infact was invited to post this here by PYSIH. In fact i wish this godamn story would stop haunting me.
That tylenol quote you cited; I was trying to convey the swirling disbelief upon reading these contradictions. To clarify;
>“She then has to stop for gas too where she is probably looking for Tylenol since she is hung over. But her sister in law said she didn’t believe in medicine, so why was she looking for Tylenol?”
>In two sentences she has gone from “probably looking for Tylenol” to “so why was she looking for Tylenol”?
The only speculation on my part was that she was hung over, my bad, maybe she had a blinding migrane. It is stated in the police reports that a) she was looking for tylenol (i didn’t make that up), and b) that her sister in law said she didn’t beleive in medicine and used pot instead. SO it is a valid result to have these contradicting facts make my head spin resulting in a couple of circular sentences meant to convey that ‘does not compute’ feeling.
If more investigators, like yourself John, were on this story and not fly by night ones like me, fuzzy wuzzy, maybe some shreds of truth would come out to disprove my confabulated story.
John, I’m not going to repeat what vcbecky and fuzzy wuzzy have already stated. They’ve already slammed you pretty good for your lack of knowledge about the subject matter and for missing the author’s (fuzzy) honest and open admission that what he was writing was pure speculation.
I’d just like to know, now that the errors in you comment have been pointed out to you, and it’s obvious to everyone how wrong your entire premise was, do you plan on posting an apology to fuzzy wuzzy? It seems like the stand up thing to do, IMHO.
Oh Max, I don’t require any apologies… in fact it is the overzealous nay-sayers I am hoping for, someone with real discourse on the actual story. And by that standard, that last post was pretty pathetic. John may have missed my point about speculation, but he also failed to do anything but take a few decidely low caliber potshots at me and not address any element of the story whatsoever; so why did he bother posting it?
Where are the folks defending Mrs. Schuler? The crackpots on her side ranting about how since Danny Boy simply said he never saw her drunk so she simply couldn’t have been, and that all the tests were wrong and the conspiracy of the Westchester Co agenicies and the ??? Where are they now? The ones who assume a white middle class professional mother who just has to be innocent?
Personally, I take exception to John’s comment where he says my comments were probably removed from other sites ue to my overspeculation. In fact, i was much more offended by the classist, and racist comments that took the family at their word and blindly defended her with out using a single fact (take that Westchester News site that threatened me with the FBI while they tore the Westchester Co authorities to pieces, accusing them of corruption and lying and coverups?) I think that is more slanderous leagally than wondering aloud what demons aflicted the poor woman.
Personally, i think he could not get past my poor sentence structure in this passage.
“She then has to stop for gas too where she is probably looking for Tylenol since she is hung over. But her sister in law said she didn’t believe in medicine, so why was she looking for Tylenol?”
I agree, it looks like i am speculating on what she was buying when in fact i was speculating why she was looking for it. My bad, back to grammar 101.
What if during Diane’s brother’s phone conversation w/ her he said this is the last straw, i’m turning you over to Child Protective Services and hope they take your kids away until you get off drugs and alcohol. Diane then becomes enraged and commits murder/suicide by intentionally crashing the car. She was a vindictive bitch, this is not only very possible but probable. I don’t pity the Schuler and Hance families but greatly feel for the other non-family victims.
yup, that is it in a nutshell. My whole point, that call was the key. I am sure we will never know the truth about it, no matter how many lives it affected, the truth will never be told, unfortunately. Everything surmised above is irrelavent when it comes down to it. She was just reckless up to that point, then it became a mission.
Where are the folks defending Mrs. Schuler? The crackpots on her side ranting about how since Danny Boy simply said he never saw her drunk so she simply couldn’t have been, and that all the tests were wrong and the conspiracy of the Westchester Co agenicies and the ??? Where are they now? The ones who assume a white middle class professional mother who just has to be innocent?
The whole Amy Bishop shooter reminded me of Diane Schuler. Someone who just seemed to lose her mind completely. The husbands had the same reaction…never saw anything suspicious. Not that I would expect either to divulge too much…but nothing??? I mean these people killed inocent people…intentionally! No signs, nothing?? Witnesses stated that when Diane Schuler was on the Taconic (heading the wrong way) she didn’t swirve, was speeding and seemed fixated on the road…I can’t even imagine what those kids were going through. What a horrible way to die. As far as the Hance family goes, they may have known something was up, but not to this extent. They lost all of their children for God’s sake.
This case is drawing parallels in the reactions also, people defending or rationalizing her behavior, such as this article. There is such a trail of anger and hate behind this woman, how can anyone rationalize her reactions, I mean people have percieved injustices done to them every second of every day, but how many borrow guns, practice at the firing range, then take it to a meeting?
http://www.wowowow.com/relationships/amy-bishop-was-scorned-woman-erica-manfred-448818
Read the comments, people are seeing through this for what it is. This chick deserves an entry here herself.
Which also brings to mind Roman Polanski, who also deserves an entry.
Erica Manfred must have gone to the same journalism school as Ann Coulter and Michael Moore. I didn’t read one comment that agreed with anything she had to say in her article. What an angry, self righteous bitch. I left her a comment myself – here it is, for what it’s worth.
Nice comment Max :)
I also see the parallel between Bishop and Schuler. I think it is the result of enabling by family members and their class standing.
Both have had issues for 30 years, in Schuler’s case it was cutting out her mother when she was 9 and holding that grudge which manifested itself eventually in the murder/suicide. Her family knew this stubborn trait and should not have allowed themselves to be victimized by it and be forced to live within her parameters…. they could have refused to go to her wedding if the mother was not invited, and when she had kids and withheld the relationship with their grandmother the brother or husband should have made it clear that it is time to build a bridge for someone elses sake other than her extremely selfish perception of being dissed. She commited her first murder by pretending her mother was dead. She was probably holding the whole family hostage for over 27 years with this selfish act.
Bishop on the other hand was sheilded from the law many times with the help of her mother and father and whoever they had in their back pocket. Also her no-good husband who seems to have been complicit at least since they supposedly sent bombs to her old boss. This guy should be held responsible; he knew she had the gun and was practicing with it, knew she was disgruntled… didn’t he know she had already shot and killed someone? If that was your wife, wouldn’t it raise a flag or two? “Gee honey, why are you putting the gun in your purse?” Obviously he felt her pain if he made comments about wanting to kill the boss who fired her. They are two of a kind and just becasue she is the one who pulled the trigger this time, he should be held complicit. It was a lifelong conspiracy with those two.
To use these obviously highly mentally disturbed people as examples of why women go postal only makes it clear how beyond the pale their behavior is. Sure, we have all had raging feelings of being mistreated, not getting what we deserve, etc… but for 99.99999% of us it inspires us to overcome the abuse, make ourselves better and get on with our lives.
No one gets the pass to commit murder under any scenario, I couldn’t care less what stresses this PhD was under, or Diane Schuler with her six figure income. What about the people constantly under mind numbing stress that don’t lose it, or the poor and minority victims of discrimation and abuse who put up with it? Or oppressed people worldwide who are victimized by their governments and live with nothing but fear.
These women are siezed upon by the media simply because they are white upper middle class and make an easy example to frighten us all of what is all around us, waiting to snap. When in fact they are outliers in the land of crazy, protected by their class standing and people in the same class who can’t imagine they should be held accountable for their actions.
Interesting point but I don’t agree with everything.
To begin with, did she have marital problems? Very likely. Did she drink? apparantly so. Pot smoker? Maybe. The McDonalds conspiracy theory is not likely. If they said she didn’t appear intox., I believe it. I doubt the entire staff would ignore an intox. person who is traveling with many small kids. It wouldn’t take more than 2 sec. to call 9-1-1 and report her. Secondly. I viewed the surv. tape at gas station. I have seen many “professional” drunks in my day and not one of them can be twice the limit and walk as well as she did, not to mentioned stoned. Then fuzzy mentioned her hesitating to leave the pump before driving away. Maybe she was putting her credit cards/wallet away, maybe she was waiting for one of the kids to buckle up. I have 3 small kids who many time struggle with seatbelts. She wasn’t necess. dumping vodka into her McD OJ. The drive off. Definately nuts and irresponsible, but all she is guilty of here is driving like an A-hole. The apparant suicide. Does anyone here know if she was wearing her seatbelt? Assuming by the impact and aftermath, she likely would have been ejected in not wearing it. The kids are just a sad sad story. Burning to death. If she did intend suicide, I don’t think she believed this accident would happen as bad as it did. She might had thought they would survive since the impact would likely be head on, killing only the front seat passangers. But still very sad to know someone can ever do this to anyone, no less children. Her alcohol/pot smoking. One one can blame her for alcohol use as long as she did it at home in a controlled envt.. So her hubby saying she never drank was irrelevant (with exception to crash). Pot smoking, well thats another story. I wonder if her husband and dead child would test (+) for traces in their blood? If she smoked nightly, it is likely that traces are in her kids blood or hair due to 2nd hand smoke exposure. What ever the reason, it is a tragic ending. I wonder if her husband will have her exhumed. I haven’t seen anything in the news lately. However, well written Fuzzy.
I think that your essay is very interesting, I just do not agree. I believe that this woamn was a closet drunk, not on a suicide mission. I personally knew a drunk who could walk and talk like any sober person while ieing completely inebriated. Princess Diana was killed by such a drunk driver. The driver looked totally sober but was drunk as could be at the time. The woman had issues that she concealed well. One of those issues was a useless husband.
Great Essay.
To add my deep thoughts:
From what I’ve read Schuler did not drink before or during work, but she needed to drink a lot before returning home. On the date of the crash, she WAS doing exactly what she normally did: getting drunk on the way home.
Normally, her husband was at work when she arrived home since he worked a night shift. She probably overdid it on Sunday because she would arrive home when he was there.
Obviously, things in the marriage were pretty damn bad, so no need to go into that again. I don’t think she had issue with being a mother, but had issue with being Danny’s wife.
I think she was feeling ill and when she pulled the car over, the one child called her father, Schuler’s brother, Hance. I think either Schuler heard him or spoke to him herself. The brother probably knew his sister was drunk. The Hance’s daughters were old enough to figure that out and notice exactly what their aunt was pouring into her drink. I don’t think Schuler considered these girls could read a bottle or notice it under the seat.
When Hance found out, I think he threatened her with calling the police and how her kids would be taken from her, etc. At that point, I believe Schuler threatened to harm the kids if Hance called the police– “I hear any sirens, etc. I’m crashing this minivan from hell.” From what I remember, she was in front of one of the police barracks when a call was made.
It puts Hance in a pretty damn serious catch-22. I think at that point their was no way she was NOT going to crash the van; it was the girls noticing what she was drinking and it was the phone call that sealed their fate.
After the crash, there’s no way Hance could go public with that. And really, while I know three others were killed, he just lost his children, so it may not be a priority to go public. He was just in a no-win situation. I don’t blame either him or his wife. This may sound crass but what they are dealing with is on a whole other level than the other victim’s families. The sister just murdered your children after they called you begging for help and you were helpless to offer any, do you really care about talking to the police? No, screw the world.
I don’t think she was in a blind rage, but she was in a blind panic because she was caught. You cannot talk your way out of this especially when it involves family.
As far as the Mc and gas attendant, at best, her actions only look suspicious in hindsight.
fixed courtesy of your friendly neighborhood editor
-max